No. The Republican Party is now a cult devoted to a person. The party will not be able to move on until that person is out of the picture.
this post was submitted on 27 Oct 2024
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Even if he loses this election he'll be a kingmaker behind the scenes for the rest of his life. On top of being the default candidate every 4 years until he dies.
We're gonna be deprogramming these people for the rest of our lives.
Are they going to rebuild or they just trying to migrate and take over the Democratic Party? We have this tendency to assume that this country is going to be two parties just as they are right now for the rest of our time but parties have changed in America many times. Hell, these two parties virtually swap places once. Nothing says it can't happen again.
Considering the number of republicans who have officially come out in support of Harris, even if it's just to avoid trump, it’s certainly possible.
The brand is kind of poisoned, they should abandon it, let the wackos have it, and come up with something new.
Honestly, they could take over the Libertarian party quite easily. It's not like its current leadership is particularly effective.
Libertarian is socially liberal though, that's the last thing Republicans want.
Dunno if you've seen much of the LP, but they are definitely not socially liberal.
NOPE!
Trump happened because large segments of US voters feel disenfranchised and resentful, as they feel they have been left behind and that their lives have been made worse by the policies of the political establishment and experts. If said political establishment and the experts want to end the Trump movement and prevent something similar from happening again, they're going to have to address the concerns of dissatisfied voters. I don't really think either party knows how to go about doing that.
I think part of the reason for that is there's still significant discussion about what has caused so many Americans to become so unhappy with leadership, and you can't really come up with a solution until you correctly identify the problem. I still don't think the experts have a very good grasp on why Americans are upset. Until they figure it out, they can't come up with a solution, and until they come up with a solution, movements like Trumpism are still very possible.
Trump is happening because far right republicans realized after Watergate that if they wanted to get away with crimes in the future, that they needed to have news that presents "alternate" facts that are favorable to their narrative or that would at the least muddy the waters. Roger Ailes his plan worked basically.
Without censoring his appearances, Trump comes across as petulant/weak/selfish/stupid/hateful/... Without censoring his history, republican voters would have known that he was a serial scam artist, serial adulterer, ... Basically without that alternate fact media supporting rightwing skullduggery, there would never have been a president Trump.
Imo it's nonsense to claim that Trump getting elected, is happening because voters are angry because of mysterious reasons that no one can figure out, when those voters are so misinformed that they consistently vote against their own interests and believe stupid conspiracy theories that are being pushed to rile them up against the "other". As long as that many people live in an alternate reality based on lies and hate, there is no helping them. So the challenge becomes: how do you bring them out of it and how do you prevent it from happening again in the future.
it's nonsense to claim that Trump getting elected, is happening because voters are angry because of mysterious reasons that no one can figure out...
That's not exactly what I am saying. It's more that there isn't yet a consensus of what the root problem is. There are a lot of theories, sure, like yours. That's one theory, but, confident though you may be that that is the exact problem, not everyone agrees, or at least they think there's more to it than that.
I think there might be some truth to your theory, but I don't agree with the idea that these people are essentially doing fine, but they've been brainwashed into thinking they're not doing fine. That it's all just a result of some kind of mass hypnosis. That kind of erases the very real problems that many of these people do face.
One thing we can all agree on is that the problem that upsets voters has nothing to do with lack of healthcare, inability to purchase a first home, lack of a decent social safety net nor anything to do with inflation, money in politics or dark money corporate pak donations
It's really not hard to identify why, but billionaires will spend their life savings convincing people that late stage capitalism and oligarchy work.
The new left party that forms in the wake of the Republican implosion will rise out of the growing union movement that is already organizing to address that fundamental problem.
At what point will voting for that new left party become optimal?
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always has been
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when they reach 33%
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when Republicans reach 25%
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when Republicans are literally gone
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other
When they run candidates for lower offices in "safe" districts, and can win seats there. At that point, they can force the Dems into coalition building.
Or when the Republican party has about as much influence as the Libertarian and Constitution parties. Either/or.
If you plan to wait until you can vote for them in a national election then you're missing the point.
The democracy you're looking for is built from the bottom up, starting with your coworkers.
The first vote you should be concerned with is a card check election to unionize your workplace.
This also applies to much of the left. It’s because the US is an oligarchy and doesn’t have representation that is proportional
People are downvoting you but it's correct. The left has no representation in this country. It's just far-right and right when you go to the polls.
If Trump loses, I don't know that there will be a Republican party. The top people all hate each other and the only thing that unites them is brown-nosing Trump. They will tear the party apart all trying to replace him.
It really won't be hard. Both sides (the trumpet and the old school) know they need the Republican brand to win. They'll have a primary and then they'll do what they do best: fall in line.
Which will be the optimal outcome
The Republican party won't go anywhere as long as we have a two party system.
You say that but how do you unite extremist and moderate views? You don’t, it’s unsustainable. So no the party won’t fail to exist but if it fractures enough, it will take time to reform. A pretty long time.
They unite under their dislike of the other side and/or their supposed policies.
We don't have to have a two-party system. There's no law requiring the Republican party to stay together. It's just in their best interest to do so. I don't know that they'll care about what's in their best interest after Trump. They'll be too busy tearing each other apart, something they've wanted to do since 2015.
The two party system is an inevitable consequence of the FPTP election system. Replace that, and you can have multiple parties. Otherwise, you might get a short period of chaos with multiple parties which then settles down to the two winners.
Ironically, I could see that being the catalyst for ranked choice voting.
The Democratic party will become the new right wing party. The question is whether the Republican party will survive in a new hyper fascist mode, or a real left wing party will pick up the pieces.
My hope is for the latter, but realistically it'll be the former.
Don’t do that. Don’t give me hope.
I'm trying really hard to not be a pessimist right now for what I think are obvious reasons. It's not easy.
Realistically, I'm jazzed to learn that my post-2024-election predictions from 2015 are already coming true.. we might actually get the good future where the Democrats are the right-wing bad guys.
I used to see it that way but now? I doubt it will be that simple. So what if Trump is gone and no other republican leader can fit his shoes? Do they even have to?
Maybe it can be even more beneficial for the republicans to have a dead Trump. They can finally have complete control over his thoughts, his brand, image, his idealogy. With ai technology they can insert a nostalgic idealized version of Trump that he never was. More charismatic, more cohesive, malleable, and eternal. A figure like Jesus, like Mlk, like founding fathers. Who cares the real trump is dead? You can do anything with a base that is so hopelessly lost.
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I have to think there's something going on behind the scenes to organize a schism in the GOP, no matter what happens in this election. I think it's unlikely that Liz Cheney and people like her will be able to wrest control of the current Republican party away from the fart sniffers, so they're going to have to split and make a new party.
The outstanding question is "Why haven't they done this already?" Maybe there's just not enough solid support to pull it off ahead of the election, surely because there are a lot of people who are sniffing the farts out of fear, and they don't want to burn that bridge yet.
Pay real close attention after this election. Lindsey Graham is going to show his other face again, and a whole bunch of other politicians will, too. Yes, there needs to be a path to redemption, but that path is going to have to include resignation for the likes of Graham, Vance, McConnell, anyone who supported Trump, then very much didn't, and then supported him again. Such people cannot be entrusted with elected office.
so they're going to have to split and make a new party.
They know if they split off, they will lose the party forever. Voters will never switch, they need the Republican brand. This isn't about 4 years later, this is about long term.
Trump brings out the crazies to the primaries like no one else. This is why the old school just keeps their head down, they're just waiting for Trump to bow out and hopefully the crazies eventually stop showing up to the primary.
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Maybe y'all shouldn't have made it so hard for third parties to run.
I wouldn't mind a new socialist party in the u.s politics.
It'd be great if any of them had a proper ground game for local elections instead of just popping up every 4 years and only hyping a presidential candidate. They look too disorganized to take seriously.
It's more fundamental than that. First-past-the-post voting systems inevitably turn into two-party rule. It's built into the foundations of how the American government is voted for.
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