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[-] kboos1@lemmy.world 85 points 6 days ago

I'm not against EVs, I'm against subscriptions for a vehicle that already costs more than $60k and feels like toy.

[-] limonfiesta@lemmy.world 31 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Unfortunately all new cars, including EV's, sold in the American market have been repurposed into intelligence gathering apparatuses.

I will not buy any car that has any generation of cellular modem built-in, let alone AI cameras to constantly scan my face.

Which means I'll probably be driving 2010 era vehicles for the rest of my life, which frankly I'm okay with.

So even if they regulate or ban subscription car features, you're still stuck with a giant 24/7 spy box in your garage.

[-] invertedspear@lemmy.zip 15 points 6 days ago

Look into which ones have the modem on a dedicated fuse for easy disabling. The modern F150 generation, including the Lightning EV truck, have a single fuse you can pull that disables a few things, none of which are vital.

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This it the main deterrent for most "innovations" these days. No, im not going to subscribe. If you require a subscription its a non starter.

[-] ramble81@lemmy.zip 8 points 6 days ago

Curious what subscriptions you’re talking about. I have an EV and I pay for traffic and the iphone app, but both of those require cell service and remote servers that need upkeep. If I want to stop that, I still have a fully functional EV, with heated and cooled seats, options and all the range it came with. It’s a 2024 Audi too.

[-] acosmichippo@lemmy.world 8 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

I have an EV and I pay for traffic and the iphone app, but both of those require cell service and remote servers that need upkeep.

Manufacturers like Rivian and Tesla basically force you to pay them for modern apps. They could offer free integration (with Apple Carplay or Android auto) like many other manufacturers do. Why should we have to pay them for stuff we already have on our phones? It's a blatant money grab.

CarPlay/AndroidAuto is one of the reasons I went with a Ford EV.

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[-] chronicledmonocle@lemmy.world 23 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

The reason Americans don't buy EVs is because all EVs sold in America are:

  1. More expensive than their ICE equivalents initially
  2. Are made by idiots like GM who make their cars only pre-2023 or for one year in 2026 (seriously GM just make the fucking Bolt)
  3. Nissan.....who just FINALLY got it through their fucking heads that air cooled batteries and Chademo are bad ideas as they're about to go bankrupt
  4. Are Tesla and financially supports the trillionaire neo-nazi.

There are very few basic, cheap EVs on the American market. Tesla is really the only one and most of us refuse to support that prick.

I just bought a used 2023 Bolt EUV a few months ago. Absolutely love the thing. I got it for $15.5k and it still has 5 years of warranty. And GM decided "hey....you know that car you love? We're going to stop making it because it doesn't have the margins our big boi SUV gas guzzlers have. Sorry and fuck you".

[-] blitzen@lemmy.ca 6 points 4 days ago
  1. They depreciate faster than room temperature milk.

Now, that depreciation may be (or probably is) offset by the decreased fuel and maintenance costs, but I see this point too often ignored.

[-] Warl0k3@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

I'm planning to get an EV (when I can afford one, who on earth can afford to buy new cars??) but my biggest concern is with battery degradation - it's improved a bunch, but you're still looking at 80-85% capacity after 8 years with gentle use - which if the car already just barely has the range I need... nngh. It really doesn't get talked about and it's such a huge part of the logistics you need to consider when getting an EV.

[-] blitzen@lemmy.ca 2 points 4 days ago

Not to mention the need at some point to replace the battery, which can cost thousands.

I don't mention that and the depreciation bullet point to disparage EV adoption. It's a good thing we are moving away from ICE to EV. But it's a little like two steps forward one step back, and most people don't talk about the one step back parts.

[-] chronicledmonocle@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago

Batteries don't usually just "die" though. You don't have to even think about replacing it. Even if a 250 mile EV loses 30% of its capacity after 8-10 years (which is higher than most besides older gen Nissan Leafs), that means it can still drive 175 miles.

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[-] isVeryLoud@lemmy.ca 4 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Hyundai and KIA are notably missing from your list. Besides the DC converter failures, they're very solid.

Toyota / Subaru make EVs, but in a "fiiiine, if you insist" way, their heart really wasn't into it and it shows.

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[-] blitzen@lemmy.ca 13 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Go back 10-15 years (and ignore everything we've learned about Elon Musk.) Tesla's were objectively cool.

But now they're high priced, and software locked, track everything you do and everywhere you go, will trap you inside if caught on fire, require costly body work if in a fender bender which also takes forever, have replaced buttons with screens and door handles with software, and depreciate like a lead balloon.

No, dumbass, we're not against EVs, we're against your version of EVs. If Honda ever puts out an Accord EV with Android Auto / Car Play (and priced appropriately), the EV wars are over. That's all we want.

[-] mojofrododojo@lemmy.world 5 points 4 days ago

meanwhile honda has retreated on EVs... .AGAIN....

I so want to convert my old honda element into a 40-60m range EV. it's so damned compact and handy.

[-] echodot@feddit.uk 3 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

I don't understand why they can't just make electric versions of their most popular cars. I'm not saying take the chassis and literally just get rid of the engine and put motors on the wheels because that's where you get things at the Nissan leaf from. But they can start with their popular cars as a good jumping off point.

Personally I want an electric version of the Ford Estate, with fold down and removable back seats for when I need the extra storage capacity, two hook on the back, roof racks on the roof, and lots of buttons. I don't need self-driving unless it actually works and I don't anything clever doing with the door handles, It's a car that's going to be driving on the road at 60, it doesn't need to be particularly aerodynamic.

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[-] _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.works 45 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

I would consider buying a new EV as long as it was affordable, safe, good quality, and didn't spy on me. Otherwise, I'm sticking with old manuals and bikes.

Also, anyone who wants to charge me a subscription to use anything on the vehicle I own can eat all of my shit and hair.

[-] synae@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 5 days ago

Idk about the telemetry in the electronics in regards to privacy but we just got a 2021 Bolt used (previously leased w/ 12k miles) and it was 17k USD out the door and my wife loves it. It gets charged off solar at home and we laugh at people talking about gas prices. Bikes, trains, busses, and regular old feet are also a big part of our lives, but IMO people acting like EVs are an impossibility are deluding themselves to defend a harmful status quo /shrug

[-] _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.works 6 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

You might want to look into what spying it is doing and how you can mitigate or disable it. It may be as easy as pulling a fuse. For now, my only EVs are e-bikes with basic enough components that they're not capable of spying.

[-] kalpol@lemmy.ca 11 points 5 days ago

Its the spying and subscriptions that keep me away.

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[-] mojofrododojo@lemmy.world 4 points 4 days ago

eat all of my shit and hair

ew, waiter, there's a hair in this shit!

[-] RickyRigatoni@piefed.zip 48 points 6 days ago

American auto manufactutereeurs are trying to sell us $60k cars in an economy where we can barely afford usedslop.

[-] Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works 39 points 6 days ago

Yeah, it's because the vehicles that are selling so incredibly well in Europe aren't available in the US, namely the BYD range.

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[-] voytrekk@sopuli.xyz 23 points 6 days ago

One of the largest issues is the American mindset when it comes to buying vehicles. Many people consider all of their needs, even those that might be yearly. Most EVs have the range to handle 99% of most peoples trips, but they consider that last 1% of a yearly road trip when thinking about range. It's one of the reasons that Trucks and SUVs are so popular with their higher capability.

[-] IWW4@lemmy.zip 11 points 6 days ago

How can you not consider your all of your needs when buying a vehicle?

[-] chuckleslord@lemmy.world 19 points 6 days ago

You can rent a truck, but owning a truck means you have to pay more to haul around a bunch of stuff you don't need. That's why you shouldn't be worried about every possible thing you might need a vehicle for.

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[-] acosmichippo@lemmy.world 10 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

It's more over-weighting rare long road trips compared to everyday use. People are terrified of having to spend an extra 30 minutes charging an EV on a road trip, but don't think about all the time they can save on a weekly basis by never having to go to a gas station, or never having to get oil changes, etc.

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[-] ubergeek@lemmy.today 7 points 6 days ago

Trucks and SUVs are popular because they can be made cheaper due to government subsidies and lax emissions laws that exempt them.

That's on top of the massive tariff in place for any truck imported into the US. Its a main reason the Big 3 basically stopped making sedans.

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[-] Alpha71@lemmy.world 4 points 4 days ago
[-] FireWire400@lemmy.world 14 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Says the CEO of a luxury EV brand that only makes SUVs and pick-ups that sell for >60k. Can't imagine why no one is interested...

[-] AbidanYre@lemmy.world 7 points 6 days ago

You clearly didn't read the article. Did you even read the headline?

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[-] halcyoncmdr@piefed.social 14 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

From my experience reading the various articles everywhere and driving an EV exclusively since 2018... it is 100% misinformation, largely based on media coverage. And the media's lack of updates as technology has advanced quickly. Not all of it is intentional misinformation, some is just obviously ignorance by whoever is covering the topic.

There is the disinformation campaigns from the fossil fuel lobby, but that is separate from just poor journalism and people not updating their beliefs from previous reports they heard years prior.

Most US manufacturers have only produced the minimum EVs required for things tax breaks. And several of the big foreign manufacturers selling in the US have done the same, or cancelled plans to expand. Or they're focused on Hydrogen still for some reason despite 2+ decades proving that's a failed technology for consumer use.

So you really just have new startups on the scene, like Rivian, and Lucid, and a couple companies making mid EVs that clearly still use ICE thinking and just have an EV powertrain dropped in them, not taking advantage of the things they can do without an ICE engine.

A big indicator of this is if they still have an Engine Start/Stop button. There is no reason for that to exist in most EVs, especially if it has a mobile app and can have settings changed and starting things remotely. The vehicle is never "off" so there's nothing to start, just have it turn "on" when the key is inside. Tesla has done this basically since the beginning just fine. Getting in an EV and having to press a useless button just because that's what the ICE version needed is pointless and shows a lack of real development for the vehicle.

[-] Nollij@sopuli.xyz 16 points 6 days ago

The start button (or app, or whatever) absolutely does something, and to say otherwise leads me to think you need to dive in deeper to how they work.

The button closes the contactors, activating the high voltage battery pack. To do otherwise is a massive safety risk. It also verifies the key (to prevent theft, and required by law) and on some models launches the parts of software needed for driving.

I'm not familiar with Tesla's design, but it should be easy enough to set the code to run this process whenever the door closes. Whether that's what people want is a different question entirely.

[-] xylol@leminal.space 8 points 6 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

Yeah Chevy got rid of the start button on the 2027 and it turns on* when you close the door. Its one of the common complaints I read about on the subreddit. It would annoy me as sometimes I dont need the car on and automatic things annoy me

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[-] FunStuffIsFun@eviltoast.org 14 points 6 days ago

I WANT a start/stop button or key. I do not want smartphone control. It is a car, whose sole purpose is to haul me around from place to place. Why does it need all of that extra crap?

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[-] noahm@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

Rivian's CEO also says "AI Defined Vehicles" are the future and that this is what buyers really want, so screw that guy.

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this post was submitted on 11 Jun 2026
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