this post was submitted on 18 Sep 2024
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I'm not sure I should start this conversation and I've been rewriting this a lot lol. But I could use some relating and opinions from fellow internet leftists

Ok so, to keep it really simple: I happened to share a meal with somebody I really liked. I have interacted casually (no flirting) for about a dozen minutes total and we exchanged contact because of shared-interests (not dating)

Now my brain is fried

I'm thinking about her way too much and it gives be bad vibes, she probably has no idea and I can't imagine the sheer horror of realising that someone is thinking this much about you after so little interaction.

I want to be a well-behaved straight (kinda bi but that's beyond the point) guy, I'm trying to be an ally to the feminist cause, so, failing this spectacularly at behaving normally in relation to women disgust me. I know I can't remove the patriarchy from my body but I damn wish I could.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 31 minutes ago

I always feel hesitant posting here since I'm not a native Hexbearian, but as a woman I might offer some perspective.

I have been in the same position as you. I go to a school with a bunch of hot guys, I don't speak to them, I see them for 2 seconds in the hallways and later they become part of my night fantasies. For days, weeks. Sometimes it's romantic, too.

Would some of them be horrified to find out what's going on in my head? Probably. Are my thoughts wrong, immoral or otherwise destructive? No. My thoughts make me feel happy, it's my happy place with a handful of hotties, I can escape to it when I want and who knows, maybe I'll pursue one of these males irl sometime.

My point is, if you can at all relate to what I just wrote, then you are not wrong nor at fault. I appreciate that you are being aware as a man of the implications of thinking about this woman so much, but attraction and feeling smitten is natural no matter the sex and societal structures.

Like somebody else said, if you decide to shoot your shot and she rejects you, and you respectfully accept that, you are not a creep. What matters the most is how you handle the possibility of being turned down.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

Man, hopefully it isn't creepy. I always have so many unjustified crushes at a time.

If I think someone is pretty or if they are nice to me, boom, crush. Other reasons as well, of course, but those seem more justified and being pretty or nice are the quickest ways for me to unjustifiably crush on a stranger.

I don't always do anything about it but I think it's natural to be attracted to people?

Maybe spend more time with her before deciding to ask her out though. You may learn something about her you don't like that snaps you out of it. I also get over crushes just as quickly as I get them, maybe because it doesn't actually mean anything but I don't know. And if you want to test the waters just give her an appropriate compliment next time you're hanging out and see how she reacts, like "You look really pretty today" or "I really like your [hair/nails/makeup/etc.]". I genuinely like when women do their nails so I like to compliment them on it because, well, I genuinely like their nails, even if I'm not trying to hook up or date. It pretty much always makes girls light up and blush. But if you do this and she seems uncomfortable by it then you have a good indication not to push further. Just be honest about what you're complimenting and, for the love of God, don't make your delivery of the compliment creepy.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

We appreciate the vulnerability Comrade. It is a brave thing, and a good topic to bring into peoples conscience, especially if there are youngins here who need to hear it (which there shouldn't be! where are your parents?! don't you know these people are COMMIES?!)

Maybe some perspective:

spoilerMen and those socialized as men are generally completely starved for affection and attention and acceptance in a world that, for the benefit of capital and naturally out of capitalist social relations and the general legacies of individual private property which preceded them, trains in them many malformations such as to be hyper-individualistic, beyond-self-sufficient, and "strong" (in the patriarchal sense, no vulnerability, forceful, entitled, etc). You are trained to be in constant competition with others and to see others as 'in constant competition with you'; and to internalize all of these things as 'personal failures of yourself' when you fall short to meet an impossible collection of standards while seeking basic human emotional and social needs. You are trained into developing a conscience and disposition totally at odds and totally counter to deep community, vulnerability, collaboration, and companionship.

Men and those socialized as men are also trained that they can only 'appropriately' get affection and attention and share vulnerability with (and only kind of) from romantic partners/interests (with a whole shitload of things tied into what that means and the dynamics there, not gonna get into that right now), which makes these feelings and needs and any baggages and emotional-mental sufferings pressurized through a funnel directed at "the one possible romantic interest who looked at me or said a nice thing to me or hugged me which is the first time this has happened in 4 years."

The thing to do is be aware of this, as you clearly are (maybe have a therapist if you can afford one, or a trusted friend who understands all of this and can keep you grounded but won't blow up your spot or shame you over it, but again those are hard to come by for men in a hyper-atomized 'individual-competitive' society who are trained to be and act these ways), take deep breaths, immerse yourself in other hobbies and such, and try to scale back your behaviors to what you clearly know in your mind to be the level of "normal and appropriate for the dynamics with this person," while still enjoying the warm fuzzies because it's one of the few pure good things left in the capitalist hellscape that has intruded and commodified every aspect of human experience and existence and made us see things in this lense (even dating apps like Tinder I find utterly dystopian). Let it torture you in the ways that make you feel you are living a poem, but don't let it upset your life, and don't let these things override your conscious respectful engagement with this person driven by cognition that just uses the warm fuzzies as a little extra fuel where appropriate. You can do this with the understanding (that you obviously have) that these are hormones, and we exist in a social and societal context that makes the experience of them and expression of them complicated.

Socialization in this framework itself an exhausting game of guessing and gesturing. I hate it, but with this all in mind you'll be fine. And you might fuck up, but that's life, and you'll learn from it. It's the only way to. Or you can just say fuck all that noise and pain like me ("I can quit any time I want, I've done it a hundred times!")

And understand that even if you were to fuck up and come off too strong, and this person said they didn't want to talk to you anymore, if you said "okay I understand" and respected that, you wouldn't be a "creep." You'd be someone who feels a lot very strongly and deeply and hasn't yet developed the tools and understanding and experience to guide them in directing it properly. You'd be someone who fucked up, realizes they fucked up, and is working so the next time you don't fuck up again (or fuck up in a different unique way, providing another learning opportunity).

The thing not to do is do what you are trained to do, that is, internalize all of this (or even imagined potentialities of all of this) as shame and personal failure, and self-sabotage. You don't need to carry the baggage of the (occasionally very tactless and counter-productive) discourse around the many multitude problems that patriarchal men carry and subject women to, and the very serious grievances and frustrations they have struggled to be allowed space to voice; because you are very obviously paralyzingly aware of those problems and your disgust at the thought of perpetuating them. Don't discard your cognizance, because you need to keep yourself in check as society tries to exploit every contradiction it can to make you into a patriarch or aspiring-patriarch, but you don't need to carry it and beat yourself up as if you are all of the bad things people say about your gender and sex.

This is also part of why I am very forceful and adamant in saying that patriarchy does not benefit men; it destroys men and has them destroy each other and destroy themselves or otherwise submit to being destroyed. Patriarchy does not benefit men


it benefits patriarchs. The side-effects of this are certainly real gendered imbalances, which exist and need to be highlighted and struggled against, but those don't exist to benefit men, they exist to entice men into engaging in patriarchy and reinforcing it, with poison false-promises that 'they too, might one day be a patriarch;' and with sleight-of-hand misdirection mislead them that there exists an escape for working class men from the hells patriarchy creates for them in the first place 'if only they would'. Men who are not patriarchs, can't be patriarchs, or don't want to be patriarchs, suffer immensely at the hands of patriarchy in a plethora of horrifying ways, some more visible than others. How many hundreds of thousands of men have been beneficiaries of patriarchy in the trenches of Donbass?

This is of course not a reason to get into some oppression olympics of "we have it hard too" because 1. in most cases you'll lose


others don't even get the sugared-droplets of enticement; but mainly 2. that is exactly the competitiveness that these propertied power structures try to induce in you


by making it a competition, patriarchy has succeeded in conditioning you back into patriarchal power struggles, which inevitably reinforce it and strengthen the social dynamics of capitalist patriarchy. (Incidentally, this is the purpose that the "red pill" garbage serves, manipulating millions of young men suffering under capitalism and its patriarchal superstructure, who've been made to internalize their suffering and bewilderment and carry the baggage of the often-shallow and essentializing discourses around the necessary struggle against the worst trends of attitude and action of patriarchist men; who find speaking-with-forked-tongue to aspects of their very real and often-unheard or actively-mocked suffering and confusion some grifter dipshit mysoginist to funnel them back into (cishet-normative) patriarchal individualist cynical competition and impersonalizing against other men, against women, and non-binary-conforming people; thereby reinforcing the patriarchal structures that undergird capitalist society)

Instead, recognition that patriarchy hurts everyone in unique but still catastrophic and no-less-unacceptable ways, ought to drive all working people within and without the gender binary into uniting against its destruction. Which also means the destruction of capitalism and the private property relations which undergirds-as-the-base the superstructure of patriarchy (a core example of this connection between patriarchy and capitalism would be how the unpaid gendered labor or 'social labor' in the "traditional nuclear family" is used to subsidize costs of the "minimum socially necessary labor time" of the worker for commodity production which manifests in wages; therefor cutting costs and raising margins for the capitalist, with which to extract as surplus value and reinvest in capitalist competition. We are not in competition with each other, we are in competition against the systems and structures which seek to keep us in competition with each other, and against those who actually rule them.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago

World class post, this should go in the bestof comm.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago) (1 children)

It’s called an infatuation or limerence. It has nothing to do with patriarchy or feminism lol. You can’t control who you like. Self control is more important. If you like her, great. But if you don’t think it’s appropriate, then don’t do anything. Take her down the pedestal. It’s healthy to have a short term infatuation, but when it destroys your soul and mental well being, then that’s a problem.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 hours ago

It’s called an infatuation or limerence. It has nothing to do with patriarchy or feminism lol.

I really thought it would have something to do with r**e culture or something. Like, is there something in our education that pushes us to appropriate women with our throughts and desires without any form of consent? I mean, of course one doesn't have to literally say yes to inhabit your inland empire, but maybe she should at least be part of your life, not just a one-time meeting, so that at least she knows she's got a place in your brain even if she never knows exactly which, see what I mean?

And yeah know women can be obsessive creeps too but it's like everything else, not because they're women they're always at the vanguard of the struggle against patriarchy

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

I don't know. Thinking about it. I met this woman, when she walked into the room once. I nearly died inside. She was stunning. I've never met anyone like her. I was smitten, not just on looks, but on so many aspects of her. I was secretly having a crazy crush on her for AGES. Thinking about her. Seeing her out, but not wanting to be pushing, etc.

Then, one night we were at a party thing, and she just locked lips with me in the lounge room of all places. She, it turned out, was wildly attracted to me also, all that time. Who'd have thought?! I was being so well-behaved all that time.

She's my wife now. Total win. 16 years later, and we're still wild for each other. I have no idea how that happens as I'm turning into an old guy, but, she's damn fine, and I'm still smitten when she walks in the room. Maybe even more so than back then.

I'm a fan of "go for it". For if we didn't, we'd not have experienced all the joys, tears, ups and downs, and grown our love for of all these years together.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 hours ago

Aww beautiful story meow-hug

[–] [email protected] 17 points 15 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 17 points 15 hours ago (2 children)

You're getting a lot of "You do you, bestie!" in the responses and I'd like to gently push back on that. As someone who shared with them the false liberal thought that "there's no ethics of cognition/feeling," I have since come to learn that there is and it can be kind of important for your mental health to recognize that, depending on what challenges you experience to begin with. Some cognitive patterns can have a negative impact on you inherently (negative self-talk is a classic example), some can more directly get in the way of doing positive things (read any testimonial about porn addiction), and some will make you more prone to harm others (pedophilia, for example). Counterproductive thought patterns can catch people by surprise at various points in their life, but they shouldn't shrug and say "You do you, bestie!" and then indulge in those patterns.

That said, I think you're fine, this sort of thing wears itself out in a matter of days normally and, if it hasn't, you should probably seek more serious advice. In the meantime, rather than beat yourself up for having a crush (beating yourself up is another negative pattern), it would be much better to simply try to redirect your thoughts to something else. If you are incapable of refocusing after you've had the moment of lucidity needed to realize you should refocus, then that's another sign that it's a more serious issue. That said, there is probably nothing serious about it.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

Problematic thoughts and unhealthy thoughts aren't the same thing, I always read the advice as meaning "there is no thoughts you should feel shame over" which is pretty good advice actually because shame doesn't help correct thought spirals that much

[–] [email protected] 3 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

I agree about shame and you'll notice I mentioned something to that effect (beating yourself up). I think the line between "problematic" and "unhealthy" is a bit hazy, since problematic thoughts tend to be anti-social and anti-sociality is unhealthy.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago
[–] [email protected] 7 points 14 hours ago
[–] [email protected] 34 points 18 hours ago (7 children)

There are no thought crimes.

If your outward behavior hasn't changed to make them uncomfortable, you're beating yourself up over nothing, comrade

[–] [email protected] 7 points 14 hours ago

There are no thought crimes.

As a nineteeneightyfour supporter I have to disagree

But seriously I do feel like it's creepy, it's only my subjective experience and I don't necessarily feel guilty about it but I do feel wierd and uncomfortable

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 17 hours ago (8 children)

the good news is, i know black magic and if you cashapp me 50 bucks i actually can remove the patriarchy from your body

the bad news is, this deal is running out in the next 15 minutes, so act fast!

[–] [email protected] 10 points 14 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

please lower your voice, SIR, you are exuding your patriarchal privilege and it is SCARING me.

if only you took advantage of my offer... if only....

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

wait they make justified crushes?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 14 hours ago

I mean, kinda? Like, having a crush on a classmate is typical school experience, and even if you don't interact much with them you're in the same room on a day to day basis. Also having a crush on a friend of a friend you spent some time with is totally normal.

My point is, when you have an actual relationship growing it's totally alright to start having romantic feelings if the person is attractive to you. But getting sick with love with someone I just met once kind of rubs me the wrong way

[–] [email protected] 28 points 18 hours ago

It's extremely normal, just don't behave like a creep

[–] [email protected] 32 points 18 hours ago (2 children)

Most crushes are unjustified. Sometimes, that's the only way for a crush to exist. You get to know someone and the ick kicks in strong.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 18 hours ago

This is normal human stuff

[–] [email protected] 49 points 20 hours ago (5 children)

/uj Feelings are feelings, only actions cross the line into inappropriate territory. You had a pleasant interaction and got the warm fuzzies, nothing wrong with that. There is also a chance, can't really say without additional context that this person wanted to date you. I certainly don't give my contact deets out to everyone I share a cig with.

/rj how fucking dare you, you must take SSRI to remove all libido or you will go viral as an abuser.

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 19 hours ago (9 children)

Falling this hard after meeting somebody once for a dozen minutes may be more indicative of other personal stuff rather than just being a "creep"

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (2 children)

You're fine

I mean if your thoughts are about doing extremely unsavory/innappropriate/violent acts to her that's an issue, but this sounds like just a normal crush. I've absolutely done this with people I barely know before, hell I do this with people I see on the TV that I'll never meet irl.

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