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this post was submitted on 06 Jul 2026
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You can experience altered states of mind without it. It dulls your minds and blunts your senses, making you think you're having a better time than you are. Hardly the gift to humanity the marketing tells us it is.
Yeah, that's literally the point. People are too annoying to socialize with for any amount of time without the help.
If you can't tolerate your existance in the same space as people without being inebriated then that's a skills issue. I've gone to therapy for less.
Whatever you say buddy. I tried rawdogging being sociable for 15 years and couldn't find a way to enjoy it. Once I started drinking it became easy and people like me better too because I'm not stressed out after 20 minutes of being somewhere.
I just stopped being sociable lmao. If you need to get drunk to do it it's because it's not good for you, doesn't even make you happy. You can socialize just fine over dinner and be home by 9PM so you can get ready for bed. The whole going out until 2AM is just an insane thing the bar industry sells to make money. Sure, a wedding some once in a lifetime event, yeah go crazy all night. But it's insane the amount of clubbing people do, as soon as i stopped drinking and going out late everything in my life got much better very quickly.
What does this even mean? How can someone be having a less good time than they're having? Are you drunk?
Happens all the time, they think they're having a good time but then they wake up look at their texts and photos and start to remember they were miserable the whole evening and texted an ex several times.
Are you? Because that's not what I said.
To elaborate, alcohol reduces your sensibilities so things that aren't that fun seem fun, and conversations that aren't that interesting seem as though they are. Look up altered perception and diminished perception.
I'm not saying it's completely useless, but to become the central crutch of social interaction like it did is not healthy for your brain or your quality of life.
The dirty little secret of a lot of meditation gurus--especially those that were in the first wave of the 1950 and 1960's--is that most of them experimented with psychedlics to find the doors first, then tried to find it themselves without drugs.
Alcohol isn't a psychedelic though, yes absolutely we should decriminalize/legalize a lot of psychedelics. Alcohol is just a polar solvent that poisons every cell in your body, literally it dissolves across every cell membrane you have and fucks shit up.
Yes, but alcohol doesn't challenge social reality the way psychedlics do; is it any wonder that THAT is the drug that's legal? The one that numbs the pain without offering any different perspective?
Also, not sure who you're replying to me twice, but I'm bringing up psychedlics in context of the person I'm replying to, not the overall context of the post.
Yes, it was a hodgepodge of indulgence/decadence and an attempt to find meaning in the psychedelia. We seem to be in a better place these days when it comes from teachers/leaders, thankfully.
What do you mean "we're in a better place"? You mean teachers aren't handing out tabs of LSD anymore?
I tried meditation for about 3 years, daily. Never really got into it. Couldn't do more than 30 minutes without things getting buggy.
I'm very interested in taking a mushroom trip to see what's out there. Psychedlics are risky, yes, but they have their place.
You cannot in good faith make the argument that white Western meditation is still at the naive and primitive state it was at in the 60s / 70s. We are awash with well-seasoned meditation teachers today who do not use any substances. Getting high is not meditation.
I know people who forage for these things. They walk around with a slight smirk, in response to something that is not actually happening except in their own minds. It's called derealisation. Please consider the underreported harmful effects people are living with before engaging with this stuff. It's not a substitute for alcohol.
There is research showing that Psilocybin and other substances can help depression, PTSD, etc when administered at very specific doses and in a specific way. But that's a different thing.
Getting advice on psychedlics on the internet is pretty crazy; the people most active in the forums say there is no danger and they've been at least micro-dosing every day for years.... but I guess if it really messed with your brain, you wouldn't be active on the forums.
That's great that there's a "specific dose and specific way" to carefully use psilocybin, but I don't have the money for that, much less even know who to talk to.
But my point about meditation is that it is a dead end for a lot of people and that maybe if they'd had a trip before, they'd know the experience was something worth pursuing and maybe having an easier time getting there.
I'm not arguing that you can't or shouldn't, but for the benefit of anyone interested in meditation: tripping on drugs do not take you to the same place. It is not a "shortcut" to meditation. It's a "play random song" for brain chemistry and structure that may be entertaining or life-ruining. It depends on the day.
For anyone interested in social lubrication (which is what motivates a lot of alcohol consumption), tripping on drugs is not the way out.
If you need medical attention, I can understand. I was considering psychedelics before I got my ADHD diagnosis.
I've worked in the area of mental health since, know people who've taken ayahuasca, iboga, psychedelics & amphetamines. If you feel you've nothing to lose, then irreversible change that everyone except yourself notices might be acceptable. But I've even had a friend die under the guidance of an experienced officer of ceremonies at a publicly-advertised retreat. If you can afford targeted medical treatment, I'd advise that first.
Anyway, not to lecture you. I'm nearly fifty and just want to help people where I can. I've seen and learned a lot. People who are experienced with psychedelics are not as sagely as they think.
To make an analogy, meditation is like riding a pony somewhere, where as psychedlics is more like a hitchhiking on the highway. With meditation, you are more in control but travel slowly; you can control your destination. With drugs, you're at greater risk and have less control over where you actually end up, but you get there quicker.
Maybe psychedelics don't get you the same place as meditation, exactly, but they get you out of a town, and if you're main interest is in learning that there is SOMETHING out of a town, then it's a related process.
My problem is that I'm kind of having a soft existential crisis and if I could poke my head out from beyond the cloud of my consensually constructed reality, I think that might give me a different perspective on things.
And, like I said, I gave meditation a sincere effort.
But thank you for the article; I'm aware that there are risks and plan to limit them as much as possible.
Best of luck with whichever path you take my friend. I hear you on the existential thing. The books I was reading in similar circumstances labelled it a “dark night of the soul”. Took me a long time to figure that one out in my own way. Fare well.
Yeah, partially it's just a career crisis; I'm almost unemployable despite having a Master's Degree, maybe because I'm just a little bit autistic, and because I've been abused the field I need to make nice in. Today I'm applying to a fast food job, wondering how much I can rent my apartment for and if it would leave me enough to live out of a van while I work somewhere.
But after a life-time of depression and anxietey and psychiatric medications, I feel more confident of myself than I ever have, I just don't belong in the world I unforunately am forced to inhabit.
Yeah, Long Dark Night of the Soul is a book by Spanish Monk St. John of the Cross. There's a pretty cool YouTuber by the name of Britt Hartley, ex-mormon, who talks a little bit about her experience with Sufi gurus. Apparently, there's a whole community across the world in EVERY religion who are about directly experiencing reality and not standing on ceremony about it. Western psychedlic use is one path, other traditions use psychedlics in their own way (the article you linked, by the way, did mention using psychedlics within a religious context was a protective factor--but whether it would protect me as an atheist is an open question)....
Anyway, thank you for sharing your experience with me, even if if "did not contribute to the discussion" lol (Edit: oh, it looks like you slipped into positive vote territory)
And I'm so sorry about your friend.
I'm really sorry that you had an experience like that in your field of choice. I also chose to transition to a factory job for a few years despite having a degree because of chronic anxiety, possibly trauma, with my original field of study at the time. It did help for a while.
It must have been tough if you're in a better place now but still feel perpendicular to the world. It sounds like you've experienced a lot, studied and reflected a lot on your options. I remember reading Gurdjieff around the same time as Dark Night of the Soul, looking for answers. Possibly some overlap the Sufis you mentioned.
I tend to not think of voting when I'm struggling to articulate myself the way I'd like to, as I was earlier. Anyway, at least it wasn't AI :)
And thanks for mentioning my friend. I hope that whether it's to a lesser or greater degree, that you find what you're looking for.
One thing that clicked for me when I quit alcohol for someone I loved, was how even after one drink, my decision making was not my own, but the alcohols.
I realised that going "just for one or two" drinks meant that even when I returned home, I wouldn't do any of the more wholesome things afterwards like reading or gardening. I certainly wouldn't have felt right spending time with kids in the family. I'd just watch TV or something. So yeah, while moderating my drinking I realised there was no point in having any.
Alcohol can absolutley cause isolation sometimes. It's very demanding