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A Florida high school required parents' permission for students to watch Disney's 'Tangled,' prompting some to say local education laws are 'out of control' (www.businessinsider.com)

submitted 8 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

54 comments fedilink hide all child comments

One parent said the influx of permission slips is getting "out of control" and "burdensome."

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[–] [email protected] 122 points 8 months ago (4 children)

This is fucking insane:

"I had to sign a permission slip for my child who could drive himself to see it in a movie theater," Judi Hayes told the outlet.

Parents like Hayes said they must sign a new permission slip for after-school programs and events almost every week.

"It seems like it's just it's out of control. It's every single activity. And it's burdensome on the staff because they have to chase down permission slips. The club's sponsors are getting frustrated and giving up because it's too much work," Hayes said.

Hayes added that she even had to sign a form so her child could receive pre-calculus tutoring with their teacher after school. The teacher referenced the Parental Rights in Education law in notes to parents explaining why they were being asked to sign a permission slip.

Just apart from this being a completely irrational way to go about things, can you imagine how much time this takes up for everyone involved?

[–] [email protected] 104 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Welcome to a world where everything in school has to be okayed by every parent, else they risk losing their job if someone complains.

Conservative fucks are gonna try to make this the future of public schools, because the inefficiency is the point.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Exactly. The party of small government has one goal. To make government buearacracy so big and slow you throw your hands up in frustration and not participate. So then they can come in and saw only they can fix the mess they created and only make it bigger.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Aha! The only solution to this endless waste of bureaucracy is privatization!

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago

Which then contracts out the service to the gov't for the same price, cuts the service down to the easiest bare minimum, manages to screw that up while gov't takes the blame, requires double the money from the gov't to hire a ton of labor since the service is vital, gets huge profits from taxpayer money while providing nothing, gets service barely operational, calls it a success, charges gov't more, fires most of workforce, starts charging taxpayers monthly separately on top of gov't contract, adds fees, never touches service again, uses ill-gotten double-dipped tax payer money to lobby gov't for anti-competitive regulations so no other companies can "innovate" and provide features that existed for a century when the service wasrun by the gov't.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Yet another reason I'm glad this state has a public online school program that I could put my daughter in. No permission slips ever. Even if they do have an (always optional) "field trip," it involves a parent taking them to a location and staying there with them.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

this state

Are you actually in Florida?!

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 8 months ago

"See how inefficient the government is? Education needs to be run by private companies."

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

Think of it in terms of staff salaries versus the taxes used to pay them. If you can get people to consider that, they'll suddenly want to be the party of small government again.

[–] [email protected] 69 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (6 children)

As a kid that grew up with parents that were prudish.... It will fuck your life up. Completely. Entirely.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 8 months ago (2 children)

It's interesting. My mother-in-law isn't what I'd call prudish, but she definitely restricted what her children could watch in terms of things like R-rated movies.

My father, on the other hand, was a film historian who, despite that, didn't really understand what movies were and were not appropriate for kids, which is why I saw Aliens in the theater when I was 9 years old.

We spent a long time butting heads over how far I wanted to go with my own daughter in terms of age appropriateness vs. how far she wanted to go. I eventually won that battle when my daughter turned 12 and my wife realized that there was no way to hide the world of R-rated things from a 12-year-old with YouTube anyway.

And that's why my daughter's favorite movie is now Forbidden Zone.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Haha, haven't met many that know that movie.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago (1 children)

She loves cult movies and so do I, so we watch a lot of them together.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

I love the class room scene.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago

Eh, part of the rating system is to prevent you from fucking up someone else’s kid, and part of it is knowing your own child.

You’re not allowed to sell an R movie to a 10 year old, for instance. But their parent can come in and buy it for them no problem.

And honestly, just because a movie is rated R, doesn’t mean your 10 year old can’t handle it. You likely know your kid best. But you also know that while they can handle Aliens, they shouldn’t watch Zach and Miri Make a Porno for obvious reasons.

It’s a balancing act that only works if the parent is paying attention though.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago

I still feel bad for the 1 kid in jr high whose parents refused to let him do the sex ed section. 13yos are assholes enough, they didn't really need something else to use to make fun of him for.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Yep. I loved going to the library while my classmates got to watch a movie

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Tangled? Or being with prudes? Jk

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Well these days it's probably either or...

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

yes. forever

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

Yup

[–] [email protected] 29 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

"I never thought leopards would eat my face"

[–] [email protected] 23 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Not all of us here voted for these people, Florida's voters are at least 40% democrats gauging from the last election, that's hopefully grown since all of DeSantis's bullshit, I guess we'll see in November.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Rooting for ya, bud.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago

Thanks my dude.

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Tangled is fucking awesome. It's one of my favorite Disney movies. The scene where she freaks out after getting to touch grass outside and swings back and forth between elation and self-loathing for disobeying the one rule she was taught her entire life: don't leave the tower. That scene is gold

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago

"Your dream stinks. I was talking to her."

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago

The reprise of "Mother Knows Best" always gives me chills

[–] [email protected] 25 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (4 children)

Why not a permission slip in the beginning of the year with checkboxes for everything that might need a permission slip. Is there a requirement for them to be specific?

[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 months ago (1 children)

The requirement stems from knowing that if you aren't explicit and specific, regressives will try to ruin your life directly and via stochastic terrorism.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago (1 children)

But also even if you are explicit and specific, regressives will try to ruin your life directly and via stochastic terrorism.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago

Facts. But it explains why they're trying. It's really hard for most people to accept and act on the knowledge that these people operate in bad faith and are just trying to make everyone miserable enough to give up.

The only way to win is to 1) not play their game and 2) to get a critical mass of people around you to follow you instead of them. It's like dealing with a narcissist, except there are millions of them bolstering each other and gaslighting the rest of us.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

“Yes I checked the ‘movies rated from G to T’ box, but they played Strange World, and that has the gay disease in it!” /s

People are idiots, and it’s Florida. Florida has proven itself insane, so this is why they get.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

You are really overestimating how far ahead these things are planned out. It would be a horrible nightmare to coordinate all of it months and months in advance.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 8 months ago

You have love how everyone is behind this until it becomes slightly inconvenient for them.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 8 months ago (2 children)

I'm not in Florida, but can they sign a permission slip that just includes everything.

"I, _________, do give my child permission to sign their own permission slips."

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago

Probably not. The whole point is to bog down the education system.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago (1 children)

My kids school just has us sign a media permission slip once a year. Works great.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I don't think that would cover the modern rage about anything parent

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 months ago (3 children)

The way parents can stop this is by asking the school whether they had a license from Disney to show the movie.

The permission slips are just proof they showed the movie to a large group of people (most likely without a license, because what school has a budget for that?)

[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children)

Educational purposes are fair use.

Constitutionally, the purpose of copyright laws is to promote the progress of science and the useful arts. Fair Use isn't really an "exemption". Fair Use is the fundamental reason why copyright is allowed to exist. The restrictions allowed by copyright law are the limited commercial exemptions from "public domain", temporarily granted to authors and artists.

All published information is in the public domain unless a specific, copyright exemption temporarily applies to withhold it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

All published information is in the public domain unless a specific, copyright exemption temporarily applies to withhold it.

You sure about that? In the US, the creator of a work has automatic copyright over it, whether it's published or not: https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html

If you meant something else, or there's a modifier to your claim here that I'm not seeing, maybe you could clarify?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I am reframing the discussion as envisioned by the copyright clause in Article I, Section 8:

[Congress shall have power] To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

The purpose of copyright laws is to promote progress of science and art. Temporary exclusivity is the means by which Congress achieves this purpose; exclusivity is not the purpose itself.

That limited time is when an author or inventor may command exclusivity. Outside of that limited time, the work belongs to the audience, not the artist.

When we remember that it is humanity is supposed to be the ultimate beneficiary, "Fair Use" is the fundamental concept, and copyright is the exception. Copyright may exist automatically when a work is created, but that is still a specific, limited, temporary exemption.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago (2 children)

As with most legal matters, it depends: https://www.copyright.gov/fair-use/index.html

Purpose and character of the use, including whether the use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes: Courts look at how the party claiming fair use is using the copyrighted work, and are more likely to find that nonprofit educational and noncommercial uses are fair. This does not mean, however, that all nonprofit education and noncommercial uses are fair and all commercial uses are not fair; instead, courts will balance the purpose and character of the use against the other factors below. Additionally, “transformative” uses are more likely to be considered fair. Transformative uses are those that add something new, with a further purpose or different character, and do not substitute for the original use of the work. Nature of the copyrighted work: This factor analyzes the degree to which the work that was used relates to copyright’s purpose of encouraging creative expression. Thus, using a more creative or imaginative work (such as a novel, movie, or song) is less likely to support a claim of a fair use than using a factual work (such as a technical article or news item). In addition, use of an unpublished work is less likely to be considered fair.

I don't know many schools willing to bother finding out whether the use was fair.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

This isn't actually public exhibition because members of the public in general cannot attend. This is an educational purposes deal and is perfectly fine.