The “just following orders” stage
post
at this point we should be made aware of the names of the humans causing this human suffering. name those who are 'just following orders' so they can be charged at a later date when the deaths happen.
Screw that? Forcibly remove the dictator. It won't stop. Naming and shaming does nothing when there's no rules.
Failing to name these people and keep track of who carried out the dictator's orders will make it more difficult to hold them legally accountable once the dictator is removed and we have rules again. It's far from sufficient, but it is necessary.
When Musk is reposting comments saying Hitler didn't kill the people, the public servants did, every ICE member should know their head may be responsible for these actions. The people knowing their names and reminding them of it might actually get them to stop and think about their actions
Been asking that since they started removing people from their offices. Why are media outlets not getting the names of every single agent "just doing their job" they're just complacently watching like it's a fucking TV drama.
People asking if this is legal are missing the point. This is wrong, what is legal is whatever the executive decides, ICE can only be solved with constitunially supported extra judicial action.
Going a little bit tangent, legal philosophy always fascinates me. My particular interest is international law and its paradox. It is by intention the terms "agreement", "accords" and "treaty" do not mean the same thing, and their level of legality and enforcement varies.
The cruelty is the point.
They have made clear that US citizenship does not protect you from deportation. It couldn't be more obvious that no one is safe from these fascists. So fight on behalf of those who are being persecuted (immigrants, LGBTQ+ people, women) because they're just the current front line of the battle against forces that are coming for you sooner or later.
I know it makes no difference really, but is that legal? Could doctors not intervene? Could ICE be liable for death or injury incurred from deporting a citizen?
If there was functioning legal system in the US, they could.
Asking those questions about Nazi-era German deportation/detention policy would yield the same answers.
Even prior to the current political climate, police overreach in hospitals has happened multiple times. Usually involves police arresting a nurse/doctor for not doing what the police want (even if the medical staff are in the right). Medical staff loses pay for the day, patient harm does happen because of involuntary abandonment, and no punishment is metered for the police.
So yeah, doctors and nurses are quite helpless here.
Could ICE be liable for death or injury incurred from deporting a citizen?
Yes, but only if the court will uphold the law. And at that point, the punitive measures can't bring back life or brain function.
I'm curious how deporting a legal citizen even works. Is there an exception for minors?
From the article, the family was driving from Rio Grande (in Texas) to Houston (also Texas) for her treatment, going through an immigration checkpoint, as they have done in the past but this time the entire family was detained and deported on the spot.
Generally people with family who have citizenship and noncriminals are all exceptions, they used to be called undocumented instead of illegals because even undocumented workers pay taxes in the USA. Not anymore, now anybody and everybody is at risk of deportation. They're even discussing removal of citizenship from whoever they like, as they attempted in Trump's last term.
It is worth noting that because of this policy the ICE is actually less effective at catching actual criminals.
They deported the parents. Would you leave a sick children under the custody of a state who thinks you're sub-human due to your skin color? They had no choice but to bring the kid back with them to Mexico.
why did they deport a family traveling for medical care? they weren't sneaking across the border.
Remember that whole "Constitution-free zone" thing the ACLU has been harping on about for a decade or so now? The shit happening right now is why we should've heeded the ACLU's warnings.
I've been on about that for about 3x as long, and roundly met with blank stares and outright denial. Once again, not at all happy about being proven correct.
They didn't actually cross the boarder at all, in this case. They were already in Texas and drove to a different part of Texas.
This is horrific.. What if the hospital she was at was the only one with the technology to competently treat her condition.
Would be severely fucked up for the family to lose their daughter, in addition to being deported. Hopefully Claudia Shinebaum is able to facilitate medical care for this poor girl.
mmm im just gonna stay quiet cause otherwise i'll say something about certain ppl in power that certain ppl won't like.

top 50 comments