this post was submitted on 11 Nov 2024
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The team behind menstrual health and period tracking app Clue has said it will not disclose users' data to American authorities, following Donald Trump's reelection.

The message comes in response to concerns that during Trump's second presidency, abortion bans that followed the overturn of Roe v. Wade in 2022 will worsen and states will attempt to increase menstrual surveillance in order to further restrict access to terminations.

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[–] [email protected] 328 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Research conducted by the Mozilla Foundation indicates that the app referred to in the article, Clue, gathers extensive information and shares certain data with third parties for advertising, marketing, and research reasons.

Here are some menstruation tracking apps that are open-source and prioritize user privacy by keeping your data stored locally on your device:

[–] [email protected] 124 points 1 month ago (3 children)

So the government just needs to acquire this data from one of those third parties if it wants it.

[–] [email protected] 75 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

so what they're really saying is they won't give it away for free

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

Where is Mark Zuckerberg when you need something to "accidentally" get leaked after billions of dollars are spent.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Drip doesn't save anything to the cloud, it's all local to your device. I can't speak to the others.

Which does mean one has to backup and manually move your tracking history to a new device. Guess who forgot to do that 😂

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Good idea is to use something like Syncthing to copy data between your phone and another device like a laptop or another phone. This depends on the app, for Drip you have to manually export the data yourself on a regular basis.

Another useful idea is if you have an old phone lying around get it connected via Syncthing and back up everything to it. If your current phone dies or is lost you can switch back immediately, a hot backup. If you have root on your device you can use NeoBackup to schedule backups of the data into a folder Syncthing can access and send to backup locations, say a home computer or spare device.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago (5 children)

The only way to protect data is to not gather it.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 month ago

Having your own data can be incredibly useful and valuable, the trick is protecting that data so that nefarious actors can't use it.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago

I hadn't seen this comment, thanks for making it.

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[–] [email protected] 147 points 1 month ago (1 children)

They say that, but when Ken Paxton subpoenas them they will say they have no choice. It would be better to use an app that doesn't store this data server side at all.

[–] [email protected] 84 points 1 month ago (4 children)

FOSS Period Tracking Apps Exist: (there may be others, as well)

https://fossdroid.com/a/bluemoon.html

https://fossdroid.com/a/mensinator.html

https://github.com/TotallyMonica/foss-period-tracker

Also paper and pencil.

Also the oldest known "writing" is a stick with 28 notches on it.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (5 children)

How does an app being FOSS defend them from warrants?

Edit. Thank you guys for the details. I learneded something new today, much appreciated.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 month ago (1 children)

FOSS implies it's your hardware, therefore a subpoena would extract no information because there is no information outside of the users device.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Interesting, thank you. I guess I don't know enough about FOSS then.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

"Free and open source software." It's an ethos that says that code should be free and open for people to use and improve as they see fit. The core of it is that if you modify any software that is FOSS, your software must also be FOSS. So overtime the software and what its used for improve, change, widen. Lucky for us, the movement has been ongoing for 50+ years, so it's a mature ethos whose benefits are everywhere. Most of the internet runs on FOSS. Lemmy itself is FOSS.

It doesn't necessarily mean an app is more private, but it does mean you can generally self host, as the commentor said. There isn't a profit motive with most FOSS, at least not at its core, so there is little desire to data harvest generally. There is also a heavy overlap between FOSS advocates and privacy advocates, so they tend to be more privacy conscious via local data storage or encryption.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

Just to key in on the overlap between FOSS and privacy, because the source code for the software is open, it means that anyone can take a peek at how everything is running under the hood (among other things). It becomes possible to verify that software is storing data locally and properly encrypting when applicable (as opposed to blindly trusting the software's author and or lawyers).

It may also be a fun fact that best practice in encryption is to open source your algorithms. The helps safeguard against backdoors and mistakes/ errors that could compromise the security of the algorithm. Much for similar reasons as above, as it allows the security community to check your math (in a field where it is incredibly easy to get your math wrong).

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Something being FOSS doesn't necessarily mean it's safe / ethical, but a LOT of FOSS apps are designed with those principles in mind.

However, being FOSS means that if an app claims that it is safe / ethical (ex. In this case, not storing data anywhere but on your device), you or an experienced peer can check the code to verify that fact.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It doesn't, but with these apps, you can see what information they send back to their servers (if any). If there is no info getting sent back to any servers, then there's nothing a subpoena can do since there's no info to subpoena. You can't obtain info that just isn't there.

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[–] [email protected] 82 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Don't fall for it. Read their privacy policy.

They keep your data in the cloud and share it with third parties, including advertisers.

Pen and paper doesn't snitch.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 month ago

not defending the bogus use of the cloud to host sensitive data, nor do i unquestioningly believe this? but correcting the record since you did 80% of the work in finding the link:

Be assured that the sensitive health data you track in the Clue app is never shared with or sold to advertisers, or any partners whose services we may recommend in Clue.

If you actually read what you sent it seems like the only data that is shared to advertisers is standard marketing stuff like IP, device ID, age group, and location. Still bad and I stand with others recommending locally hosted FOSS alternatives.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (1 children)

There are also foss alternatives. Install fdroid and get drip.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago (8 children)

Drip is a horrible name for a period tracking app lol

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[–] [email protected] 67 points 1 month ago (8 children)

Period tracking apps should store no data at all in the cloud.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 month ago (9 children)

Some people want convenience of accessing the data between devices.

It's okay to store stuff in the cloud just make it's encrypted deeply and thoroughly and that the user is the only person with the key.

There's absolutely no reason for them to have access to this data.

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[–] [email protected] 63 points 1 month ago

Yeah they may not cooperate with authorities, but I'm sure they'd be happy to sell it to contractors working on behalf of the government to the same ends. They already sell the info as it is.

[–] [email protected] 62 points 1 month ago (2 children)

That will last only until a judge signs a warrant.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 month ago

Or until the American people get bored with talking about it, like with everything else, then stop caring and just let whatever happen.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Or until Trump decides to have an army of hackers like Putin.

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[–] [email protected] 50 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Why the hell period data needs to be stored on the cloud?

How much could it weight? A few Kb? Local storage!

I would never trust such data leaving my device when is no need for it whatsoever.

Aren't there any open source period tracking apps? I'll do one, it can't be that hard. An sqlite database patched to a frontend calendar and some basic predictions based on normal scenarios.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

Aren’t there any open source period tracking apps?

Many. On F-Droid.

drip. menstrual cycle and fertility tracking (Open-source, non-commercial and leaves your data on your phone.) https://f-droid.org/packages/com.drip/

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[–] [email protected] 46 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

If you want an app that stores nothing on the cloud, check it out here on Android and here on IOS. My SO loves it!

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago (2 children)
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[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 month ago

Cool but the proper solution is that they shouldn't have access to this data at all. It should be either stored locally, or encrypted on their servers. Companies not being able to access their consumer data should be the default.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Why do they need to save the tracked period data to a server farm? Why can't it just be saved on the phone, huh?

[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Probably because they want to be able to maintain users during device switches. Given much of the world is on an annual or bi-annual cycle it'd suck to lose your users each time.

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 1 month ago

I wouldn't trust it. We now live in an era where, if you want control of any kind of information, you simply can't share it digitally in any way.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 month ago (11 children)

This kind of surveillance should be something every platform fights against. Remember that the government does not own you and they are only entitled to any of your data at all when necessary to uphold the law and under a warrant. Protect your right to privacy or they will use what you do I private to justify stripping you of all your other rights in the name of justice they will at that point no longer uphold.

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 month ago (1 children)

menstrual surveillance

Now that's a phrase I would've never thought I would read.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Can’t those app offer this feature : replace all the original data by pseudo random data shifting the menstruation cycle in a way that would benefit the user at that moment ? Or : shift all data to x days (easier to undo)

It’s crazy that we live in a world where we have to think about such things…

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago

First I thought "WTF is period data a thing that should concern the government", but then I noticed we are talking about the future Handmaids Tale country here.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Still not worth the risk to download it. Get a paper journal, they make ones that guide you through tracking all the necessary data.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Paper without some sort of code to hide what's happening isn't much better, considering if something ever happens you could get searched.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

Good news but kind of bad that they say this publicly.

The pro of showing support for reproductive rights, building trust and protecting user privacy is great for publicity but I am afraid the downsides will eventually lead to legal consquences, making the whole thing seen even more political than it already is and that it might have a huge impact on their business.

The last thing might sound stupid, but it's a business. And if you have crazy woman who will not use this because they support the ban on abortions the sells will go down in for example republican states making the company MORE VULNERABLE to changing how they think about sharing data to authorities or not.

And yes america has woman who totally want the government to be in control of their bodies LOL. And yes america has many people who can't even figure out the name of bordering states. States, not countries. Ask 10 americans and only 5 will know that Canada is directly above (North) of america and Mexico South.

You have Burger King removing the 1/3 pounder Burger because people thought it's less than a 1/4 pounder Burger cause 4 is higher than 3 making Burger King have less sells on the 1/3 Pounder than the 1/4 LOL.

Sometimes not talking about specific topics is "more" than even speaking about it. Just don't share data and say nothing, they won't ask. Most maga's trumpers won't ask if you don't give them a foundation to poop on.

The hilarious thing though is that most abortions are done in California, but only because of abortion tourism (example from Texas). A typicall trumper will now claim this is wrong and say democrats love abortions... This is so sad.

I am neither republican nor democrat, I am german and don't live in that country but we have trumpers too so don't worry and hang in there.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago (4 children)

You have Burger King removing the 1/3 pounder Burger because people thought it's less than a 1/4 pounder Burger cause 4 is higher than 3 making Burger King have less sells on the 1/3 Pounder than the 1/4 LOL.

That was A&W.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

Newsweek has really trash headlines. No one’s asking, yet, so that’s a terrible headline.

(Yes I voted Kamala, and yes I did it for medical autonomy reasons as well as orange potato reasons, Vance reasons, heritage foundation reasons, and Project 2025.)

It’s still a trash headline and pretty standard fare for Newsweek. Why is it trash? Because it’s classic The Boy Who Cried Wolf. When I read this headline, I need it to be real.

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