this post was submitted on 21 Oct 2024
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A Boring Dystopia

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 46 minutes ago

Didn't the US use to invade countries for much, much less of a reason than that? Sheesh.

These days I'm finding myself agreeing with the Iranian government more and more often because of Israel's crap. I don't like agreeing with the Iranian government.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Poor guy. Did he also have to murder the little baby terrorists and their sobbing, horrified terrorist moms and terrorist sisters too? Poor fella. I hope he can muster the strength to do the right thing.

Fuck Israel and fuck conservatives (including neoliberals) who gleefully support this genocide. The wrong people are being erased.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 4 hours ago

Well, did he have a choice?

[–] [email protected] 41 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

Ah yes, those hundreds of "terrorists" all nicely lined up in the road.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

How the fuck do you run someone over with a bulldozer... no matter what i think of it's not coming up good...

[–] [email protected] 4 points 7 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 hours ago

Riskiest click of the day. But I'm so glad I clicked it.

You win this thread.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 hours ago
[–] [email protected] 28 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

I swear this is almost trying to parody the title of the article about the 19 year old who was burned alive

[–] [email protected] 17 points 6 hours ago

I'm sure we'll soon get an article about how the pilot felt sad about bombing a hospital.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

I hope not that he dies but that he lives to watch everything he cares about crumble to dust as he is powerless to the winds of change

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

Dude killed himself (the one the article is about).

[–] [email protected] 101 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago) (2 children)

In the aughts, once the US torture programs started getting public attention around 2003, I did my obsessive thing on the German Reich and the Holocaust.

During Operation Barbarossa, the SS was experimenting with eradication methods. The most common was the pogrom, endorsing the locals to massacre the undesirables. When they weren't undesirable enough or it was the whole village, the einsatzgruppen (death squads) had to come do it, usually forcing them to dig a mass grave and then executing them along the side.

It was messy and brutal and gross, and there was high turnover among the death squads (the US has a similar problem with its combat drone operators). And this was a major problem.

The SS experimented with other ideas, including deathwagons that would pipe the vehicle's exhaust into an enclosed chamber to kill dozens at a time, but even that was too harsh and too slow.

This is how the prototype genocide machine was made at Auschwitz. The program was contrived so no one who interacted with the live prisoners also interacted with the dead corpses. The guy who pushed the execute button was two persons removed in the chain of command from the guy who signed off on the execution order, and none of those people had to face the prisoners or the outcome. The point specifically was to make the process of massacre less stressful for the people involved.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 6 hours ago

There was a Sonderkommando of Jews in Auschwitz forced calm down inmates before murdering them and to rob and cremate them afterwards. Exactly to keep the psychic toll lower on the SS and to ensure fewer witnesses.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

My opinion of humanity was already so low...

[–] [email protected] 49 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

It's funny, I had the opposite reaction, I see this as pretty strong evidence of our decency. It's really, really hard to get most people to behave this way, and the ones who do wind up fucked up from it (as they should).

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 hours ago

True. It's hard to make people kill, but it's much too hard to teach soldiers to refuse an amoral order.

[–] [email protected] 45 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

You would think it would be easy to find some poor conscript fuck who didn't run over civilians in a bulldozer struggling with the fact that they were coerced into being part of a genocide, but no, CNN goes with the guy who crushed human beings. Even as attempted hasbara, that's some high-level incompetence in CNN.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 6 hours ago

CNN has to run every story through the Israeli censor in their Jerusalem bureau. The only mainstream outlet that doesn't go through that process is Al Jazeera, and Israel closed their offices.

[–] [email protected] 133 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

reminds me of this bit:

"not only will america go to your country and kill all your people but they'll come back 20 years later and make a movie about how killing your people made their soldiers feel sad."

[–] [email protected] 45 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

For context, this is from Frankie Boyle's 2016 Hurt Like You've Never Been Loved.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 hours ago

I reread that in his voice.

[–] [email protected] 32 points 14 hours ago

"IN THE HUNDREDS"

Good god someone please operation overlord these mother fuckers.

[–] [email protected] 225 points 20 hours ago (6 children)

The last sentence is fucked up. If you're running over hundreds of people how in the fuck do you know they are terrorists. These people are intentionally and knowingly committing war crimes then come back home and cry about how this all made them so sad.

[–] [email protected] 94 points 19 hours ago

Anyone who runs is Hamas. Anyone who stands still is well disciplined Hamas.

[–] [email protected] 106 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

If the IDF is killing people, then they are terrorists. Not the other way around. You are to be checked for antisemitism/glorification of terrorism. Please report to your nearest IDF bulldozer.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 hours ago

Relevant, from a comment I wrote below that is buried under too many other comments:


If going to jail is the penalty for not joining the IDF, it is the moral thing to do and should be worn like a badge of honor. It’s not complicated at all unless you literally have a death penalty for not joining. I don’t care how controversial this is: if as an IDF terrorist you don’t commit a mutiny, desert, or off yourself, congratulations, you’ve net increased the evil in the world.

Sympathizing with the IDF is 1:1 the exact same as sympathizing with the SS and anyone who says otherwise has both fingers in their ears and yelling nanananana until the crunching noises under their bulldozers stop.

You cannot be systematically eradicating a people you consider inferior and also pretend you have any moral high ground. You cannot bomb hospitals and ambulances and homes and schools and pretend like you are the good guy. You cannot set up viewing platforms to have your kids watch the destruction with your own eyes and claim to be the good guy.

Not to make this about me but I’ve been running myself ragged volunteering at the shelters here in a safer part Lebanon and I’m still fucked up over feeling like I’m not doing enough. Rotting at home will make me feel even worse. I went outside for a walk and wanted to throw up, feeling guilty over being able to go outside and walk to destress as people’s homes get carpet bombed more intensely than legitimate military targets. I know damn well that if I lost my own home these shelters are full and I would have literally nowhere to go. And more people are losing their homes every hour. People are fleeing to Syria and Iraq for safety, even as the border crossings are getting hit as well.

This is beyond ”normal” human evil. If any other army was doing this we would have rows of criminals hanging from cranes in The Hague, instead we have to watch them smugly tell us we’re next in a speech from the UN. For the unforgivable crime of being born on land that apparently exists only for colonization.

Do not let anyone lie to you. A Holocaust is happening right now and it is exactly as evil as the one the Nazis committed.

[–] [email protected] 77 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

Ask Rachel Corrie, who was similarly run over by a bulldozer protecting Palestinian land. It's been over 20 years and the US still doesn't give a single shit about Israel murdering it's own citizens.

[–] [email protected] 62 points 20 hours ago (2 children)

Yeah I remember reading about her. She was an incredibly brave woman. The most horrifying part was reading about the IDF soldiers who had a pancake party to mock her death.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 hours ago

Not just soldiers.

[–] [email protected] 52 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago)

was reading about the IDF soldiers who had a pancake party to mock her death.

Yeah, they've really got PTSD from what they do. /s

Give me a fucking break.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 18 hours ago

Look at how well Israeli propaganda is working abroad. Now imagine how well it must be working on the israeli population.

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[–] [email protected] 70 points 19 hours ago (2 children)

i sincerely hope his actions haunt him for the rest of his pathetic life

[–] [email protected] 34 points 16 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago) (2 children)

I'm pretty sure they did.

Six months after he was first sent to fight, he was struggling with post-traumatic stress disorder [...] Before he was due to redeploy, he took his own life.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Wait... He crushed HUNDREDS of people with a bulldozer in less than 6 months‽ What the actual fuck.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 hours ago

Yeah, the IDF bombed buildings, then the bulldozers came in to clear the streets so the tanks could go through. At no point was anyone allowed to try to rescue anyone from the rubble, and those people are definitely not counted in the official death statistics. We'll never really know how many people were killed.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 15 hours ago

Too cowardly to do anything useful to make amends. Just let another conscript fill his space.

Brave enough to drive over Palestinians and call them "terrorists in their hundreds". Not brave enough to stand up to criticism from his countrymen. This is what spending billions of dollars on an asymmetrical war gets you: a system in which the weakest people can still take the lives of hundreds before being thrown away themselves.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (6 children)

Indoctrination is a hell of a drug.

Not saying these guys should be absolved, but they're doing this because they think they're the good guys/helping out.

We should be lamblasting their leadership and all of Israel's parliament that's enabling this.

But sometimes, soldiers are just soldiers/grunts. US Soldiers have similar PTSD after Afghanistan and Iraq. Not absolving them of sins, but when you're trained for most of your adult life to take orders and not question them, and then those orders include killing innocents, it's difficult to break from the indoctrination/control a group has had over you in the moment. Usually it's not until you're finished with your tour and you're back home and had time to decompress that you realize the horrors you witnessed and perpetuated.

Again, not justifying it in any way, but if we don't humanize Israeli soldiers, we run the risk of turning them into boogeymen like we did the Nazis. They were human too, and by not acknowledging that and how far humanity can go when they are supporting nationalist movements, we do great harm to any attempt to catch and correct these sort of things early.

There's no switch that gets flipped that turns people into monsters. The worst atrocities ever committed upon humanity were by other humans. We need to acknowledge that they're all human, or we risk repeating history.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 17 hours ago

Gee I fucking wonder why you have trauma and PTSD??? Fucking moronic fucks, zero sympathy

[–] [email protected] 11 points 14 hours ago

Aww, war criminals

[–] [email protected] 81 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

One of the reasons for creating the system of death camps was that Nazi soldiers and policemen tasked with murdering Jewish people and other undesirables had elevated rates of PTSD. Also, during the Cultural Revolution, the People's liberation Army switched to a lower caliber sidearm because all the executions were giving them carpel tunnel.

You don't want to loose sight of humanity just because you're committing atrocity.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 20 hours ago (5 children)

I know that another driving force for the gas chambers was to preserve ammunition.

The earliest versions of gas chambers were essentially "piping truck exhaust into a building." They moved on from that in order to preserve metal (from the piping), fuel, and vehicles for other purposes.

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[–] [email protected] 48 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago) (2 children)

I'm actually speechless.

I hope this guy suffers until his end.

If you run over HUNDREDS with a BULLDOZER, you deserve permanent PTSD to prevent you from ever fucking thinking of doing anything remotely like it again

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 14 hours ago

Just as Chris Hedges predicted.

[–] [email protected] 39 points 20 hours ago

ah Israelis and playing the victim, name a more iconic duo.

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