this post was submitted on 16 Feb 2024
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Funny they would say it's racist...
The gov of Canada allows any of its employees who identifies as first Nation to take extra days off to participate in traditional practices (including fishing and hunting), which is something that doesn't exist for anyone else and to me that's discrimination towards anyone that isn't Christian or first Nation considering our holidays are based on Christian celebrations...
Edit: Guess I wasn't clear? Our holiday calendar being based on Christian celebrations and first Nations getting a guaranteed 5 days off to celebrate their traditions is discrimination against people that aren't part of either group since they're at the mercy of their manager when it comes to being able to have a day off for their traditions/holidays.
Giving rights to people doesn't take them away from others.
If Christians needed this according to their religion I have no doubt they'd get it.
In fact in my country (UK) many Christian events are already holidays (Easter, Christmas). Is this not the same in Canada?
Edit:
Christians already have this in Canada. So your point is totally incorrect. This in fact brings their religious rights in line with Christians.
I'm saying that people that aren't Christians or first Nations are discriminated against because they don't get guaranteed days off to celebrate their traditions. It's 100% in the hands of their manager to accept it if asked.
Ah I see your point now.
So we should be trying to get this right for other religious groups and not complain that first nation people have it.
Giving more people rights is always better than taking them away.
My favorite solution is to treat everyone the same by making the holiday calendar secular (one long weekend a month or something of the sort) and giving everyone X personal days a year.
Yeah a certain amount of days a year regardless of religion seems the obvious thing.
This is a horrible take. Some people being more equal than others has the same effect as discriminating everyone else. Let's give just white people some right and see how well that goes over (again).
We need to give these rights to other religious groups. Not take them away from others.
Well exactly. Having privileged groups in obviously the wrong way to go about things. Even if it is looked as just "giving more rights" to a group instead of everyone else being deprived of that right.
Then you're still treating people unequally based on however many holidays their religion has. Not to mention atheists. It shouldn't go beyond "you get priority to get this specific day off over this other person for whom it's not a special day". And of course not allowing employers to deny vacation requests without a good reason, for some minimum number of days a year.
Then choose your religion based on how many days off it gets you.
I can make a new one that has a holiday every day of the year at that point.
That aside, pretending to be part of a religion for personal gain feels rather disrespectful for something that for many people is deeply personal.
Sure. Then if nobody hires you, it's not religious discrimination - they're actually respecting your religion's beliefs about never needing to work
If not hiring people based on their religion is allowed, that's in itself religious discrimination. By that same logic indigeneous people in canada should have worse chances of being hired right now because they get extra days off. (And let's face it that might even be happening, even if not officially).
Effectively it'd just mean that companies would prefer hiring atheists that don't get extra days off.
Oh, actually! Some companies do something kinda neat - everyone gets federal holidays as normal, and then in addition to normal PTO you get to choose one non-federal holiday that means a lot to you to take as your no questions asked personal holiday
This is what happens when people condense ideas into simple phrases. The quote works great when describing things like marriage equality, but something like extra days off work for some people is different. The obvious solution is flexible holidays for everyone.
Treating some better than others is just prone to issues since by treating a group better than others, the flipside is you're treating others worse than them. Flexible holidays would be a fair solution.
It's literally discrimination yo. The should never be more/less rights for specific groups like race, gender, age, etc...
No it's literally not and there absolutely should be when you take cultural biases into account.
If everyone was equal to begin with you'd be right but they aren't.
Putting a female or foreign sounding name on a CV results in less responses. So those people should be given a boost because they're already behind.
Disabled people are already at a disadvantage so giving them an advantage doesn't make anyone else worse off.
It's not a zero sum game.
It would be discrimination if only Christians got December 25 and 26 off. But that's not the case, is it?
In terms of Indigenous people getting extra holidays... well they get that because of residential schools and even worse things done by the Canadian government. I dunno, it's a whole emotional thing, there's not much logic to why 5 days off helps with all that. The government generally just does stuff like this so Indigenous people don't go to the UN and embarrass the country.
But arguing against Christmas being a holiday means the "War on Christmas" crowd won't go along with you, and arguing against Indigenous rights gets the left against you. So it's a politcal non-starter.
One religious group gets to have all its holidays off by default
One ethnic group gets to have an extra five days off to participate in traditional activities
All people who aren't part of those two groups are dependent on the goodwill of their employer to have days off for their religious holidays and traditional activities
How is that not discrimination?
If the CHRC agrees I think there must be something there, right?
https://www.chrc-ccdp.gc.ca/en/resources/publications/discussion-paper-religious-intolerance
Discrimination against religious minorities in Canada is grounded in Canada’s history of colonialism. This history manifests itself in present-day systemic religious discrimination. An obvious example is statutory holidays in Canada. Statutory holidays related to Christianity, including Christmas and Easter, are the only Canadian statutory holidays linked to religious holy days. As a result, non-Christians may need to request special accommodations to observe their holy days and other times of the year where their religion requires them to abstain from work.Footnote4But religious accommodations for other groups do exist.
Edit: sorry, this was meant for another comment. People in this thread seem to be missing the fact that non-christians and non-native people may be able to ask for religious accommodations from their workplace.
Being allowed extra days off sounds like it would be terrible for your job prospects.
?
You have to deliver fewer hours of work than other potential employees. Plus, your employer has to plan around your schedule in particular. It's a lucky break for any employer if you are just not the right guy for the job for reasons completely unrelated to your ethnic background.
Yeah we're talking about the public service here so it's not something that people really worry about, but I understand where you're coming from if we were talking about the private sector...
Oh yeah, public services never discriminate!
If there's one employer for which you can work where you can be sure they will do something if you feel like you're discriminated against due to your ethnicity it's that one.
Lol, Native Americans don't go out everyday and perform rituals to "connect with nature". That's the racist part in the post. Some Indigenous tribes probably do, but not all Native Americans are the same. There are still different tribes and ethnic groups with their own customs and culturesm
Nah, I just found it funny because the federal government applies the same kind of logic to their employees as a reconciliation measure, so it's pretty ironic.
I would say that that's the government of Canada making itself a more attractive potential employer for folks who identify as First Nation (and thanks to the Indian Act they wouldn't be able to make it up on the fly)
Many organizations offer religious accommodations, it's just usually something thats handled internally and not necessary advertised.
But it being dependent on the goodwill of your employer leaves the door open to discrimination.
Your boss is a closeted racist and you're a Muslim asking to have an unpaid day off for an Islamic holiday? Refused. You're a white guy asking for a day off to have a long weekend for camping? No problem. You're a Christian they celebrates Easter? Hey, you're off by default!
Everyone should have the same opportunities, no matter their ethnic origin or their religious beliefs, the government should be blind to that.
That's fair. I don't know enough about discrimination laws to speak on whether it already is the case (even where I am), but I agree it should be legislated.
It brings to mind parental leave packages and how employers sell themselves on those, when realistically it would make for a healthier society if strong parental leave was the standard as opposed to an exception.