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Misogynistic trans guys keep showing up at our center?
(hexbear.net)
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this post was submitted on 06 Aug 2026
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Understandable for a man to be misogynistic?
See I just don't get this one bit. I would love to be conflated with cis women. I am literally the same thing. Just with a birth defect. Like I understand you're NB and that's fine but like, yea no shit I want to be seen the same as cis women. I'm a woman.
Yea I agree this is stupid. Maybe women and fem spaces would be better. Or something idk how to word it.
No I'd say they're a misogynist/transmisogynist. I wouldn't downplay it as brainworms.
My identity is literally the same as a cis woman. What are you saying? My identity is woman. The same as a cis woman's.
Your identity is the same as a cis women but you will not experience life the same as a cis women. You face different at times worse challenges then a cis women because cis women are more protected in a intersectionality sense then trans women.
The same is true for trans men.
This isn't even covering the fact that while you might want to be cis. There are trans people (hello) who do not want to be cis.
I could be wrong but I feel like there is a lot going on here for you. But I am not excusing someone going down the path of misogyny but I also do not think it is useful or honest to ignore what has been happening in queer spaces. Some of us have been trying to raise the alarm for years and have been ignored.
This generally speaking is a place of understanding that how you feel does not change the material conditions. I have come here and pointed out the material conditions that have lead to this and yes THAT is understandable. Patriarchy isn't something that just happens because of some evil hormone, gene, or DNA. It happens through a complex society structure that enforces it. Trans men are not inherently more prone to patriarchy then anyone else. Given certain types of feminism likes to ignore the truth of women especially white women who uphold it themselves. (This has been studied to death).
I used brainworms as a short hand cause I didn't feel like typing a novel. But it is certainly not downplaying it. Pointing at a problem and saying "we should be aware of this and fix it" is not making excuses. I mean I don't really know how one could think I was making excuses after the edit I put.
Somebody always constructs the bioessentialism strawman in this kind of discussion, even though literally nobody has blamed testosterone or chromosomes.
No, it happens because men are using a complex social structure for the subjugation of women and all other non-men for its intended purpose. For subjugation. They use patriarchal modes of opression to extract labor, to violate, to silence. Patriarchy doesn't just happen. People actively practice it, people derive material benefit from it, and other people suffer from that because we are exploited, undervalued, used and pushed aside.
Patriarchy, famous for its gender neutrality. Do you hear yourself talk? Yes, i get it, there are women that participate in patriarchy. Patriarchal structures can be used by women to hurt other women, and they are used this way. And yes, white women use it to hurt women of color. Cis women use it to hurt trans women. Trans women use it to hurt other trans women. All of that is true.
But none of that changes that patriarchy is, at its core, a system that allows men the opression of women.
Why do you have to distort the nature of patriarchy like this? Why do you have to completely obfuscate who it materially benefits the most? Because these women who collaborate with men to uphold patriarchy aren't the ones who get the most out of it, they are still below men that share their class, race, etc. A white woman who becomes a class collaborator in the system of gendered class violence and upholds patriarchy exchanges servitude to white men for the limited privilege of ruling over women of color. She is still relatively marginalized even when she upholds patriarchy. She participates in a system that exists for the benefit of men.
And on top of that, it is blatantly obvious who commits the majority of patriarchal violence. It's men. And they mostly harm women and other people who aren't men.
Depending on what theyre actually going for, marginalized genders (also called MaGes or mages) or gender oppressed covers the bases without being weird but the language is clunky
I had just assumed they were largely for women, while trying to be inclusive to people who felt (pardon my language) woman adjacent? I have never been to such a group. If it is for women and trans people then yea that sounds good to me.
Well trans men are also trans. While trans men are not marginalized based on their male gender, they are absolutely marginalized on the grounds of transness, a definitely gender-related category, in spite of clearly being men. And they are frequently - and rightfully- included under marginalized genders. Because transphobia is fucking real for all trans people. Trans men are marginalized. I'm saying this as one of the most radical transfeminists on this site, i am 1000% solidaric with trans men. And i am saying this from experience with labels and modes of organizing that were supposed to include everybody marginalized on gender-related grounds under patriarchy and that are now showing their limitations more and more.
I'm German, i have been in spaces organizing under the FLINTA acronym (women, lesbians, inter, nonbinary, trans, agender) for the entire time i've been out as a trans woman. And while on paper it sounds like a nice catchall way to include everybody who is marginalized on the grounds of not being a binary perisex cis guy, in practice there has been a host of problems with the usage of this term and using it to police access to spaces. You simultaneously have trans men feeling implicitly misgendered by having their masculinity denied, trans women feeling they need to pass well enough to get past the door, terfy cis women using FLINTA exclusively for people who are not binary perisex cis women and women for those who are as if it wasn't super obvious that they are third gendering the trans and inter women, cis dudes walking into the space and saying they identify as an attack helicopter etc. etc. (yes, these are all examples i've witnessed personally).
It mostly works as intended ... until it doesn't. There's always somebody getting caught in the crossfire, there are always edge cases and it's very hard to implement a FLINTA only door policy without this very real problem: You always end up with having to enforce it. With enforcing that, you check genders at the door. That never goes well unless except for the people who pass as a cis woman or are trying hard enough that the bouncer clocks them as obvious clocky trans women. I did not notice it for a long time due to my own passing privilege, but the FLINTA approach routinely causes people of all kinds of genders to either be excluded or having to explain themselves to staff and visitors, you are basically mandating forced outings with a door policy like that. Well, in theory, in practice it means that a lot of people who should feel safe in these spaces stay at home instead after having been turned away in the past or after having had awkward experiences.
We seriously cannot organize queer community spaces on gender-based exclusion, no matter how inclusive our category who is allowed in happens to be. Queer spaces already self-select in a way that keeps away most problematic guys, the rest is best dealt with by an appropriate code of conduct and a well-briefed awareness team. That isn't perfect, either, blacklists can and are abused to bully and harass people, but it's still a more workable approach than questioning everybody's gender at the door.