this post was submitted on 22 Dec 2023
659 points (97.4% liked)

World News

38978 readers
2867 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News [email protected]

Politics [email protected]

World Politics [email protected]


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 164 points 10 months ago (3 children)

For me the most impactful sentence here is the acknowledgement that the war on drugs failed. This is obvious to a lot of us, but to politicians to say this, could mean they are actually not tangled up with the drug lords. Cheers for Switzerland, hope the legal marijuana trials triumph with positive outcomes.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The war on drugs was widely successful when you start considering that it was never meant to combat drugs. It was a political maneuver to divide the populace.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 133 points 10 months ago (8 children)

The "War on drugs" has been a colossal failure.

Legalize, regulate and tax.

At least then you can take the money out of the cartels and despotic regimes. You can then use the tax money raised to offset the harm these drugs absolutely do through social policies and rehabilitation programs that actually work

[–] [email protected] 69 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Also helps ensure the drugs are clean. The US marijuana legalization process has absolutely not been perfect but the regime of testing for pesticides and mold is very effective.

If cocaine were legal and regulated you wouldn't be hearing all these stories of people dying of fentanyl overdoses from doing shitty cut coke.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago (13 children)

It does make me wonder where they swiss government will acquire their coke. With weed, it's fairly easy to grow it wherever you need to, but with coke, you pretty much have to be in certain regions, yeah?

If that's the case, is this still going to be supporting those same cartels? If more countries legalized, we could maybe hope to see legally grown, harvested, and processed coke without all the slave labor and shit. Could be a real boon for South American countries, too, if the cartels lost power, and the cocoa plantations could be nationalized.

I just woke up, so I may be just talking out my ass, though

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago (1 children)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I'm honestly totally ignorant to whether they can be grown indoors at scale outside of their normal growing region, but that's a good point to bring up.

load more comments (11 replies)
[–] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago

The “War on drugs” has been a colossal failure.

That's only true if you believe the lies that the "war on drugs" was actually about drugs. It never has been, it was always about having an excuse to incarcerate and beat down groups they didn't like; minorities, the poor, and the left.

When you look at it that way, it's obvious that the war on drugs is actually a really successful means to an end. Just try not to have a heart and think of the countless lives they ruined to keep a boot on peoples' neck.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

For waging a war on drugs, the US government certainly imported a lot of cocaine into the US.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 107 points 10 months ago (17 children)

People. Cocaine is not maryjanes. You can get addicted badly to cocaine. There's tons of neurological effects that will cause you to not function proplerly in society. By all means smoke your ganja but don't equate hard drugs with it.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I have a completely different problem with cocaine. Namely that it is extremely exploitive to the people who grow the coca. It takes about two acres of coca plants to produce just one kilo of cocaine. Obviously, that means the people who farm it are paid virtually nothing and live on starvation wages. If it's really cheap in Switzerland, that makes it worse.

On top of that, coca plantations are responsible for huge amounts of deforestation in an area of the world that should not be deforested.

However- hundreds of thousands of people are working in coca plantations and own small coca farms and if this all ended, they wouldn't even have the meagre wages they make from coca farming. So I don't know what the solution here is.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Lots of highly addicting stuff is legal, I don't care if people do cocaine. Make it legal and safely accessible so drug addicts can participate in society and not have to fund cartels

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (14 replies)
[–] [email protected] 94 points 10 months ago (4 children)

People should note that cocaine is the widest illegal drug used in Switzerland. Cannabis is second.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (26 children)

Man, I just don’t get how that many people would like coke. It’s a shitty high, that doesn’t last nearly long enough, that has massive implications for your long term health, and it costs way too much for what you get. $50 of weed = enough for a week+. $50 of coke = maybe 30m if you’re not sharing. I’m glad I never really got it, it’s too much of a rich persons drug for me to have ever been able to service an addiction to it.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 months ago (8 children)

idk man some of the stuff I've had kept me going all night off of just a couple lines.

Quality varies wildly.

load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (25 replies)
[–] [email protected] 22 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Is it weird that this somehow makes sense with all the banking?

Why is it that the finance industry and cocaine seem to go together so often?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

High stress

Need a lot of productivity

Cocaine is good for both of those

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 76 points 10 months ago (26 children)

The best way to reduce harm with this drug to users and the planet is to get rid of the deadly impurities and high cost.

load more comments (26 replies)
[–] [email protected] 46 points 10 months ago (8 children)

I've had friends that were cocaine addicts and some that really hit the bottom. This seems insane to me, this isn't a fun and easy drug like weed imo. I've always lumped coke with meth and heroin.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Its harm potential is somewhere in between. To put it in perspective, alcohol is worse than heroin. And like alcohol addicts, your friends should be able to get a clean and safe source to reduce damage, and the help they need without any fear of persecution.

You can't criminalize problems away. It evidently didn't help your friends.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 20 points 10 months ago (6 children)

What is the source of that image? I'm questioning its validity. They have cannabis as more dependency forming and physically harmful than GHB. Unless it means something it doesn't say, like they've weighted the results by how many users there are of each drug or something.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (2 children)

LSD shouldn't even be pictured... I question the validity, as well.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

It’s completely bullshit.

I love GHB but it needs to be way higher on dependence. It’s extremely easy to be addicted to. Benzos as well. Benzos are just under heroin in levels of dependency.

Edit: full agree with you, LSD isn’t even on this chart if the chart was real.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 months ago (2 children)

My friend's brother just died of heroin overdose a few weeks ago and I just couldn't help but feel for him. How many dark alleys did he have to go to to get his high? How many sketchy people were involved? Did he have access to clean needles? He overdosed alone, and likely felt subhuman due to being relegated to the fringes of society just to get his high.

Legalization would not have kept him from getting high, but it certainly would have enabled him access to clean drugs from a safe place, clean needles, and possibly made him viewed as someone who enjoyed getting high and not a piece of shit addict. He had a problem and it being illegal only made it worse for him.

Legalize it all. He was an adult, it's his body. He can do what he wants with it, it's nobody's place to tell anyone what you can or cannot consume. He loved getting high on heroin and I don't see a problem with that.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago

He was an adult, it's his body

This seems to be widely questioned view as of lately 😞

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago (18 children)

Yeah there is no safe amount of cocaine to do. There is also no safe amount of alcohol to do. At least if shit is legalised people can decide to use cocaine or not with informed consent and can be sure they are actually getting pure cocaine.

I had a friends cousin die from using cocaine but it was because they had bought it off a street dealer and it was tainted with fentanyl. They just wanted to have a little extra fun on a night out on vacation. They'd be alive and well if cocaine was legal.

Prohibition doesn't work. It just adds suffering and stigma to addiction. One of the biggest factors to addiction is isolation something that criminalizing health issues greatly contributes to.

load more comments (18 replies)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago (5 children)

Yes but they aren't legalizing it because it's fun and safe they are legalizing it because jailing people over drugs does not help them and there is no point in filling your jails with such a high percentage of your population.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I wish it was legal in unrefined quantities. I don't want a crazy addition, but maybe I'd like a tea with some extra kick now and then.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 45 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

"Hey, remember that time the Swiss legalized blow before they legalized cannabis?"

[–] [email protected] 39 points 10 months ago (5 children)

Swiss cocaine so cheap and widely used they’re considering legalising it

As prices halve on ‘highest quality we’ve ever seen’, Bern says ‘war on drugs has failed’ and looks at it being sold for recreational use James Crisp, Europe Editor 21 December 2023 • 2:53pm Switzerland has one of the highest levels of cocaine use in Europe

Switzerland’s capital is considering legalising cocaine after admitting the “war on drugs has failed”.

Bern is weighing up a pilot scheme to allow the sale of the class A narcotic for recreational use – a radical approach which is thought to be a worldwide first.

Switzerland has one of the highest levels of cocaine use in Europe, according to the levels of illicit drugs and their metabolites measured in waste water, with Zurich, Basel and Geneva all featuring in the top 10 cities in Europe.

Prices of the drug have halved in the country in the last five years, according to Addiction Switzerland, and usage is rising. Some politicians and experts have criticised complete bans as an ineffective means of addressing the crisis.

“We have a lot of cocaine in Switzerland right now, at the cheapest prices and the highest quality we have ever seen,” said Frank Zobel, deputy director at Addiction Switzerland.

“You can get a dose of cocaine for about 10 francs these days, not much more than the price for a beer.”

Cocaine prices have fallen because the market is flooded with large amounts of the drug.

In 2022, more than 160 tons of cocaine were confiscated in Antwerp and Rotterdam alone, and much more got into Europe undetected.

While prices have dropped, purity has increased. In Switzerland, 70 to 80 per cent of the substances sold are now pure cocaine. ‘Legalisation can do better than repression’

Many European countries, including Spain, Italy and Portugal, no longer impose prison sentences for possession of cocaine, which is highly addictive, but nowhere has gone so far as to legalise it.

The plan will require existing national law banning recreational use of the drug to be changed, but Bern’s parliament supports the scheme, which would follow trials now under way to permit the legal sale of cannabis.

“The war on drugs has failed, and we have to look at new ideas,” said Eva Chen, a member of the Bern council from the Alternative Left Party, which co-sponsored the proposal. “Control and legalisation can do better than mere repression.”

She said it was too early to say how the scientifically supervised pilot scheme would develop, including where the drug would be sold or how it would be sourced.

The sale of cocaine could be based on the model for selling cannabis but with stricter rules.

Any legislation would be accompanied by quality controls and information campaigns, Ms Chen added, with the aim being to curtail a currently lucrative criminal market.

Bern’s education, social affairs and sports directorate is preparing a report on the possible cocaine trial, although this does not mean it will definitely take place.

There will be many political hurdles for the proposal to clear before it can be implemented. Concern about potential dangers

Bern’s parliament leans towards the Left but the government of the canton of Bern, one of 26 member states of the Swiss confederation, tacks to the Right and may yet be able to block the required change in national law.

Still, the decision to go ahead could come in a matter of years, or earlier if the current cannabis schemes - where the drug is on sale at pharmacies - show successful results.

But opponents of the plan have voiced concern about the potential dangers.

“Cocaine is one of the most strongly addictive substances known,” said Boris Quednow, group leader of the University of Zurich’s Centre for Psychiatric Research.

He said its risks were in a completely different league to alcohol or cannabis, citing links to heart damage, strokes, depression and anxiety.

“Cocaine can be life-threatening for both first-time and long-term users. The consequences of an overdose, but also individual intolerance to even the smallest amounts, can lead to death,” the Bern government said

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 37 points 10 months ago (1 children)

so they are good on snow this year

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago

At least someone is going to have a white Christmas

[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago

Swiss Sugar by Toblerone when?

[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I'm for legalizing all drugs but some drugs like cocaine should come with meeting with a therapist to see if you are doing the right thing for what ails you.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Not all drugs are medicinal and this is legalization for recreational use. It's okay to enjoy a drug recreationally.

It is important to deal with any public health problems that arise from potentially more people being exposed to a highly addictive substance. But it's quite clear this point that prohibition doesn't work, so it's much better to devote resources towards helping those with addictions.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 months ago

Swiss guys, sitting on piles of cash and cocaine: "man, I don't get it: everyone has cocaine, lambos and other stuff, what the fuss is about? Let's just legalize all the shit, everyone has it anyway!"

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Wait, should I be doing cocaine!?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (3 children)

For me If it's not high quality it's the most depressing drug the day after. It's not worth the 30 minute high.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›