As a programmer, and is pretty unambiguous.
this post was submitted on 24 Sep 2023
118 points (97.6% liked)
News
23397 readers
4472 users here now
Welcome to the News community!
Rules:
1. Be civil
Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.
2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.
Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.
3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.
Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.
4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.
Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.
5. Only recent news is allowed.
Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.
6. All posts must be news articles.
No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.
7. No duplicate posts.
If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.
8. Misinformation is prohibited.
Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.
9. No link shorteners.
The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.
10. Don't copy entire article in your post body
For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Congress has never, not once in its history, written a law that did not abuse the English language. Case in point: the unparseable Second Amendment.
What do you mean? The second Ammendment says "The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." That's all there is to it. There isn't any other part of that Ammendment. It doesn't have a single other word as a part of it. Don't look it up.
/me whispers "a well regulated militia"
The American militia was made up of 'minutemen' who could be ready for battle on a moment's notice.
This was just normal Americans with guns that decided to fight the british when it was possible.
The same thing applies to normal gun owners now, although their effectiveness against a state military isn't going to be nearly as much as before.
It is worse than that. (I assume you are kidding, but only about the first part.)(I assume this because I have heard this joke from others.)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
There are several versions of the text of the Second Amendment, each with capitalization or punctuation differences. Differences exist between the version passed by Congress and put on display and the versions ratified by the states.[24][25][26][27] These differences have been a focus of debate regarding the meaning of the amendment, particularly regarding the importance of what the courts have called the prefatory clause.[28][29]
I've always said that the only part of the Constitution the right really cares about is the second half of the Second Amendment.
And as a programmer, I’m pretty sure that the constitution is littered with race conditions.
I don't know anything about programming but there are semicolons all over the constitution and I think you need those to code stuff.
Fun fact: Slavery is not mentioned once in the US constitution.
It is always referred to as the 'peculiar institution.'
Shitbags knew they were fuckheads all the way back then. It's just up to the rest of society to hold them accountable.
Slavery is mentioned in the constitution. It’s in the amendments.
I was thinking the exact same thing.
I remember in college when it was about “is”.
I was thinking the same thing lol.
Tldr on the ambiguity of and?
It’s basically explained in these three sections:
“In particular, the justices will be examining a so-called safety valve provision that is meant to spare low-level, nonviolent drug dealers who agree to plead guilty and cooperate with prosecutors from having to face often longer mandatory sentences.”
“The provision lists three criteria for allowing judges to forgo a mandatory minimum sentence that basically look to the severity of prior crimes. Congress did not make it easy by writing the section in the negative so that a judge can exercise discretion in sentencing if a defendant “does not have” three sorts of criminal history.”
“The question is how to determine eligibility for the safety valve — whether any of the conditions is enough to disqualify someone or whether it takes all three to be ineligible.”
And since fucking asshole journalists and editors never mention the actual goddamn law, it's 18 U.S. Code § 3553(f)(1), here: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/3553#f
Condensed version:
The court shall impose a sentence pursuant to guidelines [...] without regard to any statutory minimum sentence, if the court finds at sentencing, [...] that—
(1) the defendant does not have
(A) more than 4 criminal history points, excluding any criminal history points resulting from a 1-point offense, as determined under the sentencing guidelines;
(B) a prior 3-point offense, as determined under the sentencing guidelines; and
(C) a prior 2-point violent offense, as determined under the sentencing guidelines;
The "and" is pretty clear. In order to qualify for sentencing outside the statutory minimum, you must not have more than 4 points, a 3-point offense, and a 2-point violent offense. In short, you must not have A, B, and C. If you have A, B, and C, you do not qualify. But almost nobody is going to have all three of A, B, and C.
That's actually far more ambiguous than I expected.
It's really not ambiguous at all. There is no reasonable way to read "and" and interpret it as "or".
Right, but with more logic-challenged individuals in mind, this is far more ambiguous than necessary. It shouldn't be ambiguous to anyone in law, though, and that's all that should matter.
So the argument is basically: (A&B&C) Or (A) or (B&C)
Correct?
Looks like it but if so IMO it's not really about and, it's about the structure of how the conditions are written down. Another and between A & B would clarify the intent if all 3 conditions need to be met.
It would not. A, B, and C means all three. If they meant any other configuration of criteria, there are existing ways of writing it that they would have used.
The citizens' argument is that the law is clear in that you are only disqualified from reduced sentencing if you meet all three conditions.
The other side, used by some courts and prosecutors, is that obviously Congress didn't mean what they wrote, so they're going to use the more punitive interpretation.
Crazy how much money we waste on the war on drugs.
All this depends on what the meaning of the word is is.