Also it’s completely fine. Because someone at some point of time has done something similar. Which gives the CCP the right to do it to other innocent people. I am very intelligent 😎
Ahh this is just so perfect. You summed up tankies perfectly. "Umm, but the usa"
But you don't need a union in China, because the party is the union! What's that? The owner of the company is high up in the communist party? Even better! Your employer definitely won't exploit you then! Good thing we're not in the US, where having a fake labor union that's run by the CEO's brother is illegal!
The semantic arguments of what people named their death machine always makes me wonder if the people making the argument understand how deception works.
"But they call themselves socialists!"
"I can declare myself God if I was so inclined; that doesn't make it true."
All Authoritarians Are Bastards
Coca-Cola likes this game, but they only do it because they also have a red flag.
They don't want to live in your oppresive regime. They want to live in my oppressive regime.
Bonus: words like Freedom, Liberty, Patriot and Heritage work like that too!
From what I can tell china is "communist" on the basis of majority "public" (state) ownership of the means of production (they tried full public (state) ownership under mao, and concluded that in china's case it would just limit socialism to "poverty socialism", where you may have the moral high ground in principle but in reality the people are starving, or so the narrative goes), and the liberation of productive forces of a large amount of people, from low income jobs to higher income jobs, sometimes using tools like automation and using aforementioned ownership of the means of production to make it be. democratic participation seems to exist too, just not in a western liberal democratic way where parties fight against each other, but rather where internal factions inside the communist party and a few associated parties fight each other, and where change must come from within. china has genuinely, using its own methods, lifted hundreds of millions of people out of dead end poverty, while also defending against hostilities from the west. it's impressive what happened, even if china has also simultaneously committed atrocities, violates human rights with for example their handling of the uyghur muslims, and still has millions of people struggling, for example migrant workers in factories who have basically no future, or the ubiquitous delivery driver who gets paid fuck all. all in all it's a very mixed bag, but it's not all bad.
of course better systems are possible, but they basically built this system "in a cave with a box of scraps" to quote the iron man movie.
democratic participation seems to exist too, just not in a western liberal democratic way where parties fight against each other, but rather where internal factions inside the communist party and a few associated parties fight each other, and where change must come from within.
You might as well say democratic participation existed in the Soviet Union.
china has genuinely, using its own methods, lifted hundreds of millions of people out of dead end poverty,
Yes, by [checks notes] adopting a capitalist economic regime in the 90s and creating massive and rapidly rising inequality.
Truly a stunning repudiation of capitalism.
let's just say there's way more nuance there, not every market economy is a capitalist market economy
not every market economy is a capitalist market economy
Ah, the People's Stock Market, the People's Investors, and the People's Billionaires. Of course.
ancient Rome had a market and wasn't a capitalist economy but rather a slave economy, for example
'Market' is separate from 'Stock Market'. The Stock Market is a specifically capitalist financial instrument and innovation whose entire purpose is to facilitate private ownership of the means of production by an investor class - ie, capitalism.
'Slave economy' is not mutually exclusive with capitalism.
The economy of the early Roman Empire is a kind of proto-mercantilist proto-capitalist position wherein both advanced investor ownership (such as legalistic forms of corporate personhood, limited liability firms, and, by some arguments, joint-stock companies) and traditional economic forms co-existed, not unlike 18th century Russia.
as it is I can't tell you whether the Chinese economy is capitalist or not. public ownership dominates the economy, and a stock market does exist, but what it does I can't tell you. just knowing what it's called doesn't do much for me. I have yet to read a book about the Chinese economy that would explain it to me. the other aspect about china I was interested in though is that they do use Marxist contradiction analysis a lot, either to solve or create problems.
public ownership dominates the economy,
... the majority of China's GDP and employment is produced by private companies; many of the state enterprises in the remainder offer stock and dividends to private investors like private companies do.
and a stock market does exist, but what it does I can’t tell you.
... it trades in ownership of firms.
I do know that stock markets trade in the ownership of companies, but to what end it's being used or whether it has any interesting features I can't tell you. I didn't know about the GDP, but I was going from the top 100 Chinese company's public ownership share (the majority of top 100 companies are majority state owned, plus an additional ~15% that's classified as mixed ownership, between 10% to 50% state ownership). that's a bit misguided of me and I apologize.
I'll worry about dumb ass tankies when they present even a 10% credible threat, till then who cares. Nazis in the bedroom and worried about commies at the door???
Considering that tankies playing apologist for Russian imperialism have had a significant effect on European politics in the past three years, and that China is a major power currently committing genocide, I don't know that "Wait until you're in line for the gulag to criticize authoritarians" is all that brilliant an option.
I love that all the responses completely ignore the issue of genocide in China and Ukraine no matter how many times I bring it up, because it's inconvenient to admit that they only acknowledge that condemning some genocides is moral. But anything to bootlick for fascists, I guess.
I get that being anti tankie is your thing, but maybe worry about the wolves that are already ripping you apart instead of the bear that might. China isn't really something you can do anything about, talking online isn't gonna do much when they don't even share our Internet space, and there are literal nazis in charge of the white house but sure let's waste energy on Russian apologists.
I get that being anti tankie is your thing, but maybe worry about the wolves that are already ripping you apart instead of the bear that might.
I'm sure you have the same exact opinion regarding Palestinian genocide as you do Ukrainian genocide.
Everyone Who Disagrees With Me is a Tankie and all your other favorite hits on Now That's What I Call Bullshit 5! Get it today!
Yeah, na try again buddy. I'm pro Ukraine, pro Palestine, anti authoritarian. But I'm much more concerned with the guy actively throwing people into an El Salvadoran gulag than the possibility of one down the line. Priorities.
Everyone Who Disagrees With Me is a Tankie and all your other favorite hits on Now That’s What I Call Bullshit 5! Get it today!
I didn't call you a tankie, I accused you of having a hypocritical position with regards to Palestinian and Ukrainian genocide.
Yeah, na try again buddy. I’m pro Ukraine, pro Palestine, anti authoritarian. But I’m much more concerned with the guy actively throwing people into an El Salvadoran gulag than the possibility of one down the line.
Me: "Tankies have had influence on modern European politics the past three years in supporting Russian imperialism and genocide."
You: "Why don't you focus on REAL threats!?"
Ukraine is under attack right now. Palestine is under attack right now.
Criticizing tankies is like criticizing Zionists.
Would you throw a fit over someone who criticized Zionists online, because "There are bigger threats!!!"?
Ah, yes, obviously I am throwing a fit in this case, not the person posting about something then attacking anyone in the comments who has a dissenting opinion. Took a brief perusal of your 10k posts (Jesus fuckin Christ dude) and gee, big surprise: whole lot of anti tankie circle jerking sprinkled in with some classic neoliberalism and so far, pretty silent on nazis. Weird.
Ah, yes, obviously I am throwing a fit in this case, not the person posting about something then attacking anyone in the comments who has a dissenting opinion.
Lord.
Took a brief perusal of your 10k posts (Jesus fuckin Christ dude) and gee, big surprise: whole lot of anti tankie circle jerking sprinkled in with some classic neoliberalism and so far, pretty silent on nazis. Weird.
Neoliberalism is when you oppose genocide, apparently. And being silent on Nazis is when you run an anti-fascist meme comm and regularly post anti-Nazi and anti-capitalist memes on Political Memes. And regularly post anti-Nazi memes on History Memes.
I ask again, since you conveniently avoided answering, most likely because you realize full well this sinks the reasoning for your entire tantrum:
Would you throw a fit over someone who criticized Zionists online, because “There are bigger threats!!!”?
Here, I'll even help you out, since it seems to be slow going getting this through your skull. What would you think of someone who posted this comment on a pic criticizing Israel:
I’ll worry about dumb ass Zionists when they present even a 10% credible threat, till then who cares. Nazis in the bedroom and worried about Zionists at the door???
Keep projecting with your "tantrum" stuff lmfao I posted a one-off comment, you're the terminally online one writing essays for each comment here.
Again, I'm pointing out that you're spending a whole lot of energy on China (no one brought up Russia/Ukraine till you did), who, little reminder: DOES NOT SHARE OUR INTERNET. That one is in caps in the hope of getting through your skull. Like, who are you attempting to reach outside of your little circle jerk? But, yeah, keep up the good fight, I'm sure it's really helpful.
Keep projecting with your “tantrum” stuff lmfao I posted a one-off comment, you’re the terminally online one writing essays for each comment here.
Christ. How many sentences in an essay, again? And how many sentences in your responses, for comparison?
Thanks for acknowledging that your previous "You're AWFULLY SILENT about NAZIS" shit was not only uninformed, but a monumentally stupid way of showing your ass in public.
Like, who are you attempting to reach outside of your little circle jerk?
The comm is called tankiejerk, genius. You came here, not the other way around. Apparently because you have a self-humiliation fetish.
Still waiting on a response to this, by the way:
Would you throw a fit over someone who criticized Zionists online, because “There are bigger threats!!!”?
Here, I’ll even help you out, since it seems to be slow going getting this through your skull. What would you think of someone who posted this comment on a pic criticizing Israel:
I’ll worry about dumb ass Zionists when they present even a 10% credible threat, till then who cares. Nazis in the bedroom and worried about Zionists at the door???
Dawg I'm not wasting my time replying to each "point" you try to make with your bullshit strawmen lol. At least if I'm railing against zionists it's in a space that someone affected could even possibly see it - literally the only point that matters.
Keep your useless little community here, I'm out: I'll stick to praxis and local organizing, you stick to posting anti-CCP memes where no one under the regime could ever see them.
Dawg I’m not wasting my time replying to each “point” you try to make with your bullshit strawmen lol.
Funny, because you seemed perfectly content "wasting [your] time" until you were called out on a point that you couldn't refute - namely, that your own logic, as applied here to asspat and play apologist for fascists (curious how often that occurs), would make it verboten to criticize Israel for its ongoing genocide.
Keep your useless little community here, I’m out: I’ll stick to praxis and local organizing, you stick to posting anti-CCP memes where no one under the regime could ever see them.
Cool, you keep telling genocide supporters that it's okay to support genocide as long as they support it somewhere where the citizens of the PRC can't see it. You can discuss your favorite flavor of boot polish with them while you're at it.
Nvmind after checking your profile you'll not be deported you are fine, you can just look other people being deported for speaking against Palestinian genocide or stuff like that 👍
Given that US imperialism and propaganda machine had a infinite more significant influence on Europe politics than ever had Russian and China, I sure do hope you'll be happy when waiting in line for being deported to El Salvador.
This might be a radical and shocking idea to you, but two things can be bad at the same time.
Yes, really. I'll give you some time to sit down and let that sink in.
Yes and being critics of the country you leave in is very brave and usefull while criticizing another country you never went to and dont know nothing about is totally useless and not brave at all.
A quick look at your post history show what type of person you are 👍
Yes and being critics of the country you leave in is very brave and usefull while criticizing another country you never went to and dont know nothing about is totally useless and not brave at all.
What's your opinion of the ongoing genocide in Palestine and its perpetrators? Neutral, I would guess, from this 'brilliant' IR take?
Wtf does this mean I should be a tanky in your logic. Of course I'm gonna shit on everyone defending or enabling what Israel is doing in Palestine, and in France the wind is shifting but since the massacre of october 7th any critics of Israel in mainstream media is antisemitism. Maybe you havent understood but when refering about your post history I haven't seen any post about Palestine but many post about tankies and how bad are China/Russia.
Of course I’m gonna shit on everyone defending or enabling what Israel is doing in Palestine
This you, genius?
criticizing another country you never went to and dont know nothing about is totally useless and not brave at all.
Yeah keep playing dumbass rather than acknowlegding the point. Critizicing the ally of you country will be punished. Just look at how many repression there has been in Europe of pro Palestinian voice.
But please keep telling how much change you're making in the world by shitting on Russia/China from Europe you lmao, you guys just love to circlejerk all day this is crazy.
Goes on anti-tankie meme community
Posts comment complaining about the post being about tankies on an anti-tankie comm
Accuses others of throwing tantrums when they bothered to comment instead of just moving on from the post
Totally just the OP throwing a tantrum at your comments tho lol. People can actually bother to talk about multiple problems on the internet y'know? And I'd argue meme comms exist for Lemmy and not the outside, and tankies are much, much more common than Nazis on Lemmy.
When you feel the need to accept everyone's voice/Chase everyone's approval, you get Nazis, do you want Nazis?
There's middle ground, murder isn't it, but neither is Godwin
Where are you getting any of that from the meme? Quite honestly you can be against both. Should be against all authoritarians regardless of where they pretend to be economically. Because they will always do what's more expedient for them to preserve power. Regardless of left or right.
Dunking on Tankies from a leftist, anti-capitalist perspective.
Rules:
We allow posts about tankie behavior even off fedi, shitposts, and rational, leftist discussion.
