this post was submitted on 31 Jan 2025
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Article: https://proton.me/blog/deepseek

Calls it "Deepsneak", failing to make it clear that the reason people love Deepseek is that you can download and it run it securely on any of your own private devices or servers - unlike most of the competing SOTA AIs.

I can't speak for Proton, but the last couple weeks are showing some very clear biases coming out.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 14 hours ago

DeepSeek is open source, meaning you can modify code[...] on your own app to create an independent — and more secure — version. However, using DeepSeek in its current form — as it exists today, hosted in China — comes with serious risks for anyone concerned about their most sensitive, private information.

They are not wrong here.

After having read the article fully it doesn't seem to be that partial and acknowledge also the failing of others. It is not as stupid as the CEO stance on "Republicans helping the little guys" for sure.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago)

Except you can't run it.

Every model You are downloading and running is simply just a checkpoint of llama....

Quit spreading that misinformation.

You, and the grand majority of everyone else, doesn't have anywhere near the hardware to run the actual full deepseek model

[–] [email protected] 4 points 14 hours ago

Lemmy users very biased link to article that isn't nearly as biased as they are purposefully biasing.

Maybe this community needs stricter posting guidelines to avoid this sort of drivel?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 20 hours ago

failing to make it clear that the reason people love Deepseek is that you can download and it run it securely on any of your own private devices or servers

That's not why. Almost no one is going to do that. That's why they didn't mention it.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 day ago

Surely Proton's own AI is without any of these problems... https://proton.me/blog/proton-scribe-writing-assistant

[–] [email protected] 121 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I hate AI but on the other hand I love how Deepseek is causing AI companies to lose billions.

[–] [email protected] 60 points 1 day ago (2 children)

The desperate PR campaign against deepseek is also very entertaining.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 21 hours ago

Billionaires are really pissed about it, I’m happy.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

We're playing with it at work and I honestly don't understand the hype. It's super verbose and would take longer for me to read the output than do the research myself. And it's still often wrong.

It's cool I guess, and I'm still looking for a good use case, but it's still a ways from taking over the world.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

The same is also true of ChatGPT. On the surface the results are incredibly believable but when you dig into it or try to use some of the generated code it's nonsense.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 day ago (16 children)

You could write this exact article about openai too

[–] [email protected] 1 points 17 hours ago

The article goes into great detail about how it's different from OpenAI so, no.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

They are absolutely right! Most people don't give a fuck about hosting their own AI, they just download "Deepsneak" and chat..and it is unfortunately even worse than "ClosedAI", cuz they are based in China. Thats why I hope Duckduckgo will host deepseek on their servers (as it is very lightweight in resources, yes?), then we will all benefit from it.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

Serious question, how does them being based in China make them worse? I'd much rather have a foreign intelligence agency collect data on me than one in the country in which I live. It's not like I'd get extradited to China.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

Yeah, the same goes for global warming "if I burn these tires nothing happens, like its not any warmer here", and then everyone does that and everyone loses on that.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago

I'm not sure I get the analogy? Like what's the global warming here?

Let me give you a quick example. Let's say that an LLM has pretty compelling evidence you're committing crimes based on what you've told it. Literally the worst case scenario thing DeepSeek could do is give that data to domestic law enforcement, which is something OpenAI is already doing.

[–] [email protected] 50 points 1 day ago (13 children)

Unsurprising that a right-wing Trump supporting company is now attacking a tech that poses an existential threat to the fascist-leaning tech companies that are all in on AI.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 hours ago

Proton has always been sketchy - and I caught flak for it countless times, especially here. But: A company claiming they are "private' and "secure" because they operate under Swiss privacy laws is already sketchy from the beginning. Why? Because Swiss privacy laws suck,are the worst in Europe and Switzerland is a country known for multiple cases of major intelligence agency overreach - especially towards foreigners and cross-border traffic.

Legally the Swiss intelligence services can order any "service provider" (that includes proton) to provide them access to traffic coming from foreign countries - this also includes the mandate to provide "technical means", which is often seen as backdoors. And to make things better the service providers are not allowed to talk about it.

This alone is a problem. In Protons case what makes matters even worse is the fact that they are an US company de facto operating from the US and therefore are bound by the homeland security act and similar legislation.

So in the end both the Swiss and US services might read your data.

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[–] [email protected] 57 points 1 day ago (14 children)

DeepSeek is open source, but is it safe?

These guys are in the open source business themselves, they should know the answer to this question.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Of course it's biased. One company writing about another company is always biased. Imagine mods of one community collectively writing a post about another community, would the fact alone not be enough? Or admins of one instance about another.

It was common sense when I as a kid went online, writing all manners of awfully stupid things memories of which still haunt me today.

You'd be friendly and respectful with all people around you on the same forums and chats. But never ever would you believe them when they tell you what to think about something.

We live in a strange time when instead of applying this simple rule people are looking for mechanisms like karma or fact-checking or even market share to allow themselves to uncritically believe some stuff.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (1 children)

This is true. However, Proton's big sell is that they can be trusted to be truthful about what is safe and what is not safe for your privacy.

I think given the context of the CEO's personal bias towards current US Republicans, and given that those Republicans are aggressively anti-China, when Proton releases an article warning of a successful Chinese AI, and seemingly purposefully leaves out the part about how people are already running it securely, it starts raising some important questions about their alignment.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Proton’s big sell is that they can be trusted to be truthful about what is safe and what is not safe for your privacy.

Which somebody who can be trusted wouldn't ever do.

Businesses sell goods, services, deals, not truth.

And privacy is not about trust.

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 day ago

Proton working overtime to discourage me from renewing.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

Tutamail is a great email provider that takes security very seriously. Switched a few days ago and I'm very happy.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 17 hours ago

Yet not great from a privacy perspective. They don't even allow third party email apps.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 day ago (4 children)

I don’t think they are that biased. They say in the article that ai models from all the leading companies are not private and shouldn’t be trusted with your data. The article is focusing on Deepseek given that’s the new big thing. Of course, since it’s controlled by China that makes data privacy even less of a thing that can be trusted.

Should we trust Deepseek? No. Should we trust OpenAI? No. Should we trust anything that is not developed by an open community? No.

I don’t think Proton is biased, they are explaining the risks with Deepseek specifically and mention how Ai’s aren’t much better. The article is not titled “Deepseek vs OpenAI” or anything like that. I don’t get why people bag on proton when they are the biggest privacy focused player that could (almost) replace google for most people!

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