this post was submitted on 20 Oct 2024

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Iran is extremely hostile to LGBTQ+ people. It's also a global hub for gender-affirming surgery. (www.lgbtqnation.com)

submitted 2 weeks ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

This is a story I heard second hand. Have not verified it cause Iranian history gives me a headache.

After the revolution Khomeini started persecuting minorities and women, despite having promised not to.

Some trans woman kept going to his house and harassed him until he agreed to at least keep protections for trans people.

Iran is the odd one out of middle eastern countries where it thinks being gay is abhorrent but being trans means you're defective and need the appropriate healthcare. Not that public healthcare in Iran is great. And people are still transphobic.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 2 weeks ago

ha, no.

if youre gay you get murdered unless you capitulate to surgery. this is just that terrible regime forcing surgery on people who dont want it but also dont want to die. it has nothing to do with trans protections/rights/whatevs

[–] [email protected] 32 points 2 weeks ago

Aren't homosexual men forced to surgically transition or be put to death?

[–] [email protected] 31 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

The conceptual framework is entirely different though. It's regarded as a treatment for homosexuality at worst, or at best medical treatment of a birth defect.

Iran isn't a hub for transgender surgery because they have the same idea about what transgender means as the US does, it's more like they accept the idea that some men were supposed to be born as women and they concede it to be a medical issue that demands treatment.

My words aren't explaining it the best, but I'm familiar with the mentality and the ideas that prop up that mentality.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 weeks ago

It blows my mind how they stumble ass-backwards into—gasp! A nuanced, partially-reasonable understanding

[–] [email protected] -2 points 2 weeks ago

LGBTQ Nation - News Source Context (Click to view Full Report)

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MBFC: Left - Credibility: Medium - Factual Reporting: Mostly Factual - United States of America
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https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2024/10/iran-is-extremely-hostile-to-lgbtq-people-its-also-a-global-hub-for-gender-affirming-surgery/

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[+] [email protected] -10 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

So, let me get this straight.

Iran does tons of gender affirming surgery (the thing the trans campaigners are pushing for more of)

It does as much surgery as the US plus more.

And all of that surgery (the entire current US surgery docket plus more) is for the wrong reasons.

So what protections are in place in the US to prevent surgery being done for the same 'wrong' reasons?

Is that US healthcare system is so notorious for its concern for people over profit and never ever advises treatments that benefit the insurance companies more than the patient?

Is the the notoriously open and friendly attitude some states have toward gays and lesbians so that those people grow up completely comfortable with expressing who they are?

Is the notoriously healthy mental state of our nation's teenagers so that every decision they make is well thought through and not at all influenced by their peer group, parents, social media, or culture?

No. It's fuck all. It's blind ideological faith that something being legally mandated and something being well marketed have radically different effects on people's willingness to comply.

Well, they do. People are far less willing to comply with something that is legally mandated and will often risk their lives to resist.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

So what protections are in place in the US to prevent surgery being done for the same ‘wrong’ reasons?

The difference is you're not forced to get it under the threat of death. And I'm not American, but as far as I know you also need a psychological evaluation to get it.

If the healthcare system was actually brainwashing people into getting surgeries they don't need that would be a general issue, not specifically a trans one.

In reality the regret rates for gender affirming surgery is usually found to be under 1%, which is extremely low and lower than almost any other type of surgery. See e.g. A systematic review of patient regret after surgery.

[+] [email protected] -6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (2 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Removed for transphobia and misinformation.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Well. That didn't take long.

Edit.

I've just noticed the post you removed. I assumed it was my rant about the implications of this news story, but no. It's the post with the actual fucking data in it from two medical sources...

Where exactly was the misinformation. Was it the Cass report, or the critiques offered by medical professionals in a medical journal?

And you wonder why people get angry about these issues...

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The point I'm making is that it's naïve to think that legal mandate has so much less a power to influence people than social pressure, ideology, marketing etc.

That's why Coca-Cola are more powerful than most governments.

lmao.

What an embarrassing thing to say. I'm sure you think you're very smart, using a diaeresis, but stop and think about what you're actually saying for a minute longer.

If it doesn't become clear to you, no, social pressure is not stronger than physical coercion with the threat of death from a police force nearly indistinguishable from the army.

And the thing about Coca-Cola is a complete non sequitur. It's possible that they are more powerful than many governments because they have unfathomable amounts of money and most countries are tiny with only a few million poor inhabitants, but it's got nothing to do with marketing.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

It's also ridiculous that they suggest that people are influenced by social pressure or even marketing to become trans. Not only does this not happen, if it did happen it would not work. Conversion therapy does not work. You can't make people trans just like you can't make people cis. If people who are actually cis transition they get gender dysphoria and become miserable.

This is just conservative fearmongering with no basis in reality.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

First, I said "so much less", it contains within it the assumption that it is less. Try reading before launching into your prejudicial tirades.

Second, Coca-Cola are an archetype for the increasing commercialisation pressure leading to the dismantling of cold-war era institutions in the eastern bloc. If the reference wasn't obvious then perhaps it is you who needs to "think" a little longer.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

the increasing commercialisation pressure leading to the dismantling of cold-war era institutions

Another thing achieved at gunpoint (or rather nuclear-warhead-point).

Also, it's not prejudicial if I'm judging you on your actual words.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 weeks ago

Another thing achieved at gunpoint (or rather nuclear-warhead-point).

... is one opinion. Success of westernisation through corporate media is another. The difference is, I'm not trying to dismiss yours.

not prejudicial if I'm judging you on your actual words.

My actual words: "so much less"

Your judgement: "so you're saying its more"

Which actual words did you use? The ones in your head?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

SRS isn't done on children. That's a lie told by conservatives who want to act like children are groomed into being trans. I really hope that's not what you're implying here

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 weeks ago

No, that's not what I'm implying. I don't believe I even mentioned children, but if you want to quote the part you think implies that children undergo such surgery I'll be glad to add an edit to clarify.