So anyway, I found myself aligned with Nancy Pelosi and against Bernie Sanders and AOC
And I figured hey you know there’s nothing there that I might need to re examine, I’m sure me and Pelosi are the ones that have it figured out here
this post was submitted on 18 Jul 2024
70 points (78.2% liked)
politics
19096 readers
4073 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
AOC and Bernie know that if they don't toe the line, they'll be blamed for the democrats losing (they'll be blamed anyway).
They did the best they could to get the democrats to adopt winning policies, but they failed.
Bernie doesn't give a fuck. (Who blames him for what)
He does nothing for image. Everything for principle.
Bernie does do things for image for the purpose of principle though - he will happily fall in line publicly over politics if it gives him political clout to make workers' lives better.
Sounds a lot like doing something on principle to me.
I don't disagree, but I did want to highlight that while not everything he does directly helps working people he's always focused on that goal. Other politicians may want to be loved but Bernie just does it for the end goal.
(You can find some hilarious interviews with him about merchandising things like Birdie and the Mittens meme - he acknowledges that it's useful for fund raising and visibility but he really has no patience for it)
Just like how nobody blamed Bernie and the left in 2016 when he fell in line after they told him
Yeah, they said hey you should forgive hundreds of billions of dollars worth of student loans, spend a trillion dollars on climate change, boost unions and domestic manufacturing and reduce income inequality for the first time in God knows how long, all while digging out from Covid better than literally any other first world country
And the Democrats said naw if we did all that I am sure the media would just fail to mention that any of it happened because they are partisan corporate hacks, leaving people with some kind of impression that Biden was an unimpressive nothingburger, so why… uh, wait…
Wait they didn’t do any of that, did they? Help me out
Also, this whole campaign has really highlighted that it's Biden's stubbornness and ego that's the problem. People are tiptoeing around the issue because in the end grandpa stopping driving is his decision and if you come at him hard he's likely to dig his heels in.
Except the state can take Grandpa's license away. Just saying.
I honestly feel that AOC and Bernie are just desperately trying to avoid a Trump dictatorship and that means voting Democrat no matter what. The Democratic candidate at this time is Joe Biden. They'll do what they have to to avoid that fate but it doesn't mean they've given up on what makes them great.
Edit: this is why https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2024/07/biden-endorse-harris-vp-aoc-bernie-sanders.html
Ours is not to wonder why. Ours is but to vote and die.
Yes. I'm a leftist, not someone that blindly follows charismatic politicians. And Im not gonna oppose something just because a politician I dislike advocates for it. Policy>personality
I also disagree with Pelosi's reasoning for wanting Biden to drop out. She just thinks he can't win. I think Joe should step aside since he enacts genocidal policies.
Por que no los dos?
She is one to talk.
Remember that billionaire wedding during COVID, with Nancy Pelosi front and center and happy as could be? There really should have been a Democratic rebellion at that. She was just doing everything she possibly could to undercut Democratic messaging for her stupid fucking social life. And then she went home and traded some stocks.
i guess it takes one to know one in this case.
Age is more than just a number. She's older than him but she can still do the political math better.
(note, this is far from an endorsement of her. I've been trying to vote her out since I moved to SF 13 years ago)
I mean you don’t have to like her but she did step down from the speakership when the time was right.
At age 83?
It’s a low bar in our current society. That said, she seemed sharp. I never got the sense that she wasn’t able to do the job, which is probably easier than the presidency.
Honestly, I don’t really share the concerns some people have about Biden being president. He’s been doing alright and his aides can take over if he declines further. The bigger issue is his lack of ability to campaign and persuade voters. Without this, he won’t win the election.
The house speaker does some campaigning but not as much. It’s more of a behind the scenes job.
I agree whole heartedly - I actually far less concerns about Biden's age when it comes to being president... it's obviously suboptimal but if there are smart people around him it'll probably be fine.
My concern is that this greedy fuck is going to be unable to win the fucking election. Trump cannot be president and my concern is Biden is making that more likely.
Except recent foreign policy failures, I mostly think Biden has done a good job.
On the other hand, I don't care much for Pelosi. The presidency is not a role where the person in charge can easily step down and give it to a younger generation: for better or for worse, the person in that seat is the one who got elected. House speaker is different, and Pelosi hogged that chair for far too long clinging on to an outdated idea of the Democratic party.
Or that's my impression anyway, I don't have an inside understanding of American politics. Thank god.
You know what they say: A broken clock is right twice a century
She still has her wits. We all age differently and it's extremely unfair at a basic level that some of us will be sharp in our 90s while others will suffer from early onset dementia before we get to retirement.
I genuinely think we need an age limit of like 65 or lower for politicians but Biden is dragging this shit out in a way Pelosi didn't. I loathe her for other reasons but never because I thought she was mentally incapable of holding her position (the stock trading on the other hand...)
Pelosi’s office in a statement said she had not spoken to Biden since returning to California on Friday — and questioned the reporting about her conversation with the president. “These sources are not good sources,” her spokesperson said.
These sources are fake sources. The story is transparently intended to force her to make public statements about Biden's competence and quality as a candidate. The author should be publicly shamed for lying.
Don't take sides. Look at the facts.
Biden is facing triple whammy - (1) poll numbers are not good, especially more than 60% Democrats wanting him to step aside, and Biden under performing D-senators/senate candidates in battleground states, (2) big donors withholding money, and (3) media frenzy.
Biden can survive one or two of these whammies but not all three simultaneously.
He'll eventually step aside. It's not Pelosi's fault. In fact, if it's anybody it's Obama, who remains silent.
Thanks Obama
I don't think it's really fair to blame Obama now, it's a clusterfuck and why would he want to get back in the middle of things. Also if we are to blame Obama for anything, it should be for him discouraging Biden not to run in 2016 over Hillary. Even if Biden lost like Hillary did back then, he likely wouldn't run again in 2020, leaving an opening for younger Democrats to enter the presidential scene, avoiding the whole situation we're in now.
The other issue is that even if Biden does drop out, what nominee would be able to survive the three wammies?
Though perhaps if Biden lost in 2016 we would've had Hilary running in 2020, and who knows if she would've won that one. Then we could be approaching Trump's 3rd term (with help from his friends in the Supreme Court) with Russia chewing through Ukraine and on their way to Eastern Europe, a fractured NATO alliance, and probably some other unimaginable horrors.
With Trump running in 16, 20, and 24, I don't know if there's a timeline change that would prevent 2024 from being an absolute clusterfuck. Unless maybe RBG had retired during Obama's term as she should have.
It is comforting to know that there's a timeline more fucked than ours.
Also if we are to blame Obama for anything, it should be for him discouraging Biden not to run in 2016 over Hillary
Deeper than that. Obama inherited the party infrastructure Howard Dean built as DNC chair that was effective at state and local levels. That infrastructure completely fell apart after Obama loyalists took over the party after 2008. Dean ran a 50 state strategy and had built the party to support lower level candidates and contest elections Democrats had traditionally ignored. Post Obama the party shifted back to a focus on marquee races that didn't really provide support to state parties and startup candidates.
That's genuinely the single biggest Obama fuckup that doesn't really get talked about much because it's very insider baseball. But it's had very real effects on how Democrats have failed in lower level elections in the years since, which has percolated up into everything else since.
Biden likely would win in 2016. The reason why is that unlike Hillary who was already paid as an elitist, Biden has the support of blue collar workers.
As the party's elder statesman, it is Obama's job to say what he thinks about party issues. But, his silence is a form of communication. It says that he basically agrees with what is happening to his old buddy Joe. Obama could have ended this a week ago by coming out 4 Square for Joe while urging party unity. He did not.
As the party’s elder statesman
That's almost 20 years younger than Biden...
And why would he think Biden is competent?
Staying silent is already wrong...
Wish that this wasn't happening now and it was more of a discussion months ago, but both parties doubled down on their aging candidates. Hoping the disinformation campaigns can be overcome though and Dems are successful bc plan 47/project 2025 legit terrify me.
Don't forget (4) the inevitable yet unpredictable effects of aging on a human in their ninth decade
While all of those are bottom-line results, it all comes back to a central theme.
We all know he flubbed the debate. But what's worse is how badly he's flubbing the response and aftermath. He said it was just a bad night. If that was true, he should've been on every news, opinion, political, and talk show the very next day, or at least within a week. Not just the usual and friendly shows, either. From Maddow to Gutfeld to Fallon, he needed to show the world that he could still do it. And he used to be able to.
Waiting a week to give a single lackluster interview, then 2 more weeks while there's clearly a fire burning? He has to know that's not an acceptable response, or else he's too insulated.
That said, this isn't the kind of thing you can publicly contemplate. You have to smother it, until you embrace it. You can't walk back from that.
I do suspect there are a number of backroom discussions, and possibly even deals being made. It won't be acknowledged until its unveiling, when he officially steps aside.
60% > 40% if the majority of democrats want them, I don’t see a problem.
60% of Dems want Biden to step aside. But he's not. So that's a problem.
Oh misunderstood 😅
But step aside in favour for who?
Probably Kamala or a Dem governor. The delegates at the DNC would likely vote based off who is polling the best
Pot, meet kettle.
Harris and a progressive vp would win, biden needs to go away now and enjoy being a old person
She was using a Ouija board to contact an ancestor but got her wires crossed and ended up in Joe's mind, being as it is half-way down the tunnel towards the light.
view more: next ›