the "parapsychology" thread got nuked but the discussion reminded me of a Return of the Repressed podcast episode I had listened to in December
it was a Q&A episode and in his typical style, the host Marcus went deep on a question posed by fan/collaborator Reid (@seriations on twitter) regarding the role of magical-religious (i.e. non-materialist) beliefs in proletarian revolution. We're all familiar with the ways the bourgeoisie promote and exploit these sorts of beliefs to their own ends (ex. Filipino aswang vampire psyops vs the Huk guerillas, Indonesian anticommunist "witch hunting" vs Gerwani feminists, Operation Wandering Soul trying to freak out Vietcong with "ghosts", etc etc etc, up to Qanon and the UFO-cult of today) -- and of course, how their own worldviews are often propped up by these sorts of beliefs (ex. social hierarchies are in fact justified by genetic blood-destiny) -- but what about the inverse? How might we use them, too?
(note with respect to the aforementioned "parapsychology" thread, this is not a question of whether some such belief might be substantiated, proven "real" or not, but rather of strategy)
Marcus explained his first intuition was to look at the history of accusations of vampirism lobbed at feudal European aristocracy (ex. Elizabeth Bathory), but abandoned this line of inquiry when his research suggested that these accusations actually tended to reflect intra-class conflict between rulers/institutions of the time, i.e. factional power jockeying.
Changing tack, Marcus then offers a long exploration of the contentious historical relationship between Chinese secret societies, magical-religious beliefs, martial arts, and rebellion.
To anyone curious about how these things might intersect (short version: it gets messy), I would recommend the episode and I'll drop some other related links below
https://podbay.fm/p/the-return-of-the-repressed/e/1703245745
SHOW NOTES
In these dark times its difficult to find reason for making believe, this will all change once you hit play. Answering Reid for almost two hours I will do my outmost to lift you spirits to unknown heights. Counterintuitively by taking a deep dive in to Chinese secret societies, covering thousands of years, culminating in a communist community exorcism by the black and red Dao.
We are talking apotropaic magic, the swallowing of protective charms, anti-fascist Kung Fu fighting, mystic mind-control and brain washing in the Tang dynasty, social tech of the Henan peasantry and the socialist Shaolin monks who would liberate Beijing from the compradors, the war and drug lords as well as imperialist invaders.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_movement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Lanterns_(Boxer_Uprising)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Spear_Society
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Spears%27_uprising_in_Shandong_(1928%E2%80%931929)
➡️ The Red Spears, 1916–1949 Tai Hsüan-chih translated by Ronald Suleski https://www.jstor.org/stable/10.3998/mpub.19970
➡️ The Red Spears Reconsidered: An Introduction Elizabeth J. Perry https://muse.jhu.edu/pub/166/oa_edited_volume/chapter/2707255
➡️ Secret Societies Reconsidered: Perspectives on the Social History of Early Modern South China and Southeast Asia: Perspectives on the Social History of Early Modern South China and Southeast Asia by David Ownby (Author), Mary F. Somers Heidhues (Author) https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/edit/10.4324/9781315288055/secret-societies-reconsidered-perspectives-social-history-early-modern-south-china-southeast-asia-mary-somers-heidhues-david-ownby
➡️ "Secret Societies" Reconsidered: Perspectives on the Social History of Early Modern South China and Southeast Asia (review) Scott Lowe https://muse.jhu.edu/article/396407/pdf
In Chinese history, peasant rebellions have been principally religious and the ruling ideology has been principally nonreligious, but go on about how religion is inherently reactionary and the absence of religion isn't.
horseshit
the famously non-religious mandate of heaven
Now that's just rude.
i'm not sure if you're doing some modern 'chinese traditional religion isn't religious' thing or just need a testament to Chinese rulers demonstrating religious conviction & presentation. i wouldn't mind learning more about the view that chinese traditions don't constitute a 'religion', but in the other case we can just look at an album of imperial temples & religious titles that emperors used
Wondering if its fair to suggest probably every premodern peasant rebellion had some religious component. I'd guess that's why the early modern/modern examples are so interesting, like a closeness bias thing
I think most elements of most premodern societies were significantly religious, so there are some other biases involved in that.
Chinese Emperors are so non-religious that they built Temples to Heaven to carry out yearly sacrifices for good harvests
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_of_Heaven
Huh is this directed at me, or at respondents in the other thread?