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ESL homework (thelemmy.club)
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[-] wieson@feddit.org 44 points 21 hours ago

Sometimes, I think it's funny that in Anglo countries it's referred to as ESL, English as a second language.

For us (and I guess many others) it was always English as a foreign language. Could be first foreign language, second foreign language...

[-] Jankatarch@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

Every time I hear ESL I go "English Sign Language?" before remembering that's ASL.

[-] Cintari@lemmy.world 2 points 2 hours ago

I thought it was renamed to ESOL, or English for Speakers of Other Languages, in 2000 or so. I guess that wasn't a totally universal change.

[-] davidagain@lemmy.world 1 points 48 minutes ago

Now EAL, English as an additional language.

[-] nialv7@lemmy.world 12 points 10 hours ago

second language just means any languages that aren't your first language. not the second language you learn.

[-] DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 3 points 11 hours ago

English as 4th (Spoken) Language Speaker here...

Before English I have:

Cantonese
Mandarin
Taishanese (well... for Taishanese, I mostly only understand but not speak because parents never spoke it to us, only when talking to the older generations and I overhear it)

Sorry for the low-key brag but since nobody here speak these languages so I just wanna mention it xD

[-] KeenFlame@feddit.nu 3 points 4 hours ago

They don't mean like a hot list for girls you like or your favorite songs, every one after native is "second"

[-] Scavenger_Solardaddy@lemmy.ml 3 points 6 hours ago

For me English is my 3rd language.

My mother tongue is Tamil, Malay is my 2nd. I do understand a bit of Hokkien but rarely practice it.

[-] icelimit@lemmy.ml 1 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

English is my 5th language. Gaelic is my 3rd.

[-] HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 18 hours ago

Majority of the world speaks a single language or two at most. Shit half the people I see online can't even speak one.

It makes sense you when you look at it like that. most people in ESL programs only speak a single language, if you speak more than two you probably don't need ESL classes and can learn on your own.

[-] squaresinger@lemmy.world 9 points 7 hours ago

Languages come in tiers. English is the global lingua franca. People use it to speak to anyone, no matter whether English native speaker or not. If someone from Norway wants to talk to someone from Japan, they'll most likely use English since both of them likely speak it.

Then there's regional lingua francas, languages like Spanish, Russian or Mandarin. These languages are popular in specific parts of the world and often used to get around there. Someone from Ukraine can speak to someone from Belarus using Russian.

Lastly, there's local languages that are spoken only in a country (or even only a part of a country). People speak them because that's what they were grown up with.

So in general, there's 4 "language slots" of languages people speak:

  • The global lingua franca
  • The regional lingua franca
  • The language of the country they live in
  • The language they grew up with

One language can fill multiple slots.

So for example, if you grew up in Ukraine and moved to Germany, you might speak the following languages, according to the slots above:

  • English
  • Russian
  • German
  • Ukranian

If you are born in Wales and never moved away, it might look like this:

  • English
  • English
  • English
  • Welsh

If you spent your life in the US, it would be like this:

  • English
  • English
  • English
  • English

This is the reason why people living in countries with lower-tier languages frequently speak 3-4 languages, while English native speakers really struggle to even learn the basics of one additional language. Because the former group has an actual use for more than one language, while the latter one don't.

[-] davidagain@lemmy.world 1 points 37 minutes ago* (last edited 33 minutes ago)

If you are born in Wales and never moved away, it might look like this:

  • English
  • English
  • English
  • Welsh

If you are born in Wales and never moved away, it might look like this:

  • English
  • English
  • Welsh
  • Welsh

Welsh is an official language of the UK and most things in Wales are in Welsh first and English second.

Away from the south and the more touristy areas, you're likely to find people speaking Welsh in everyday life (education, shopping, workplace), rather than just at home.

Oh, and Wales, England and Scotland are countries. The UK is a state made up of 3 countries and a region, whereas the USA is a country made up of 50 states and some territories and districts etc.

[-] KeenFlame@feddit.nu 2 points 5 hours ago

Or maybe french is the lingua franca..?

[-] squaresinger@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago

Not any more. It used to be, which is where the term comes from, but it hasn't been for a long time.

[-] zaphod@sopuli.xyz 2 points 4 hours ago

half the people I see online can’t even speak one

It makes sense you when you look at it like that.

Proving your own point, nice.

[-] Tja@programming.dev 9 points 13 hours ago

Source? I think speaking one language is pretty rare. Most Europeans speak at least two, most Africans I've met speak 3, lots of Indians speak 3 as well...

[-] HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 points 11 hours ago

sorry I was wrong, it's not a majority. It's roughly 40% of the world's population.

[-] Tja@programming.dev 1 points 3 hours ago
[-] Fredthefishlord@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 13 hours ago

Bit of confirmation bias in that, no?

[-] Tja@programming.dev 1 points 3 hours ago

Very possible, that's why I would love to have a source.

[-] wieson@feddit.org 6 points 15 hours ago

I think anyone in India and Africa speaks 4 languages easily.

  1. their regional language (i.e. Masaai, Yoruba, Xhosa)
  2. the over-regional language (Arabic, Swahili)
  3. a coloniser language (English, French)
  4. and possibly just enough of a neighbouring regional language

I think many Chinese people are also bilingual (i.e. Wu+ always mandarin). They often learn another language in school (English or something geographically closer, like Korean).

[-] DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 4 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago)

I think many Chinese people are also bilingual

Yes... some are even tri-lingual because of village dialect (eg: Taishanese) + province dialect (eg: Cantonese) + national dialect (Mandarin)

Unfortunately, the PRC government is heavily pushing Mandarin and some of the local variants (aka: "dialects") are slowly dying... some kids in Guangzhou don't even speak Cantonese anymore...

(i.e. Wu+ always mandarin)

Shanghaiese is semi-dead... from what I heard

Cantonese is slowly limping its way forward only because they have Hong Kong TV, I don't think there are many TV shows in Shanghaiese.

If Hong Kong falls... Cantonese is gonna die... :(

Parents also never spoke Taishanese to me... so yea I unfortunately cannot pass on that language... no Taishanese media... hard to find motivation to learn more about it.

So I only have Cantonese and Mandarin...

I doubt my kids (if I ever have any) would be able to learn it... most 2nd generation overseas Chinese kinda just English-Only with bare minimum in ancestor's language.

[-] PrimeMinisterKeyes@leminal.space 2 points 15 hours ago

Well, if you add up the number of speakers of second languages according to this page, and assume anybody speaks at least one language as their first one, you'll end up with almost exactly 1.4 as the average number of languages any given human speaks.
That's the lower bound, though, as I only added up second languages where the number of speakers is at least one million, and Wikipedia doesn't list many more anyway.

[-] JcbAzPx@lemmy.world 9 points 19 hours ago

If you're learning in an English speaking country, they're not going to call English a foreign language.

[-] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 6 hours ago

Yeah, I think in all countries with universal Education, at highschool level and even earlier there are classes for native speaking kids covering readind and writting in and later knowledge of things like formal grammatical structure and such for the local language, so it makes sense to distinguish classes aimed at foreigners to learn the local language from the ground up from classes aimed at local kids who already know how instinctivelly how to speak it.

So " as a Second Language" is a valid name, if a bit presumptuous sounding (it makes it sound as if that's the second most important language one speaks). In other countries I've more often seen " for Non-Native Speakers" or similar, never calling it a second language.

[-] ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 9 points 20 hours ago

Viewing it as primary/secondary makes more sense of it.

[-] Rooster326@programming.dev 2 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago)

Remember switching to your secondary language is faster than stumbling over the tip of your tongue.

[-] suddenlyme@lemmy.zip 3 points 16 hours ago

Its ESL in English Speaking countries, and EFL in non- English speaking countries

[-] Rooster326@programming.dev 2 points 18 hours ago

Because English as an Nth language doesn't quite have the same ring.

[-] Jyek@sh.itjust.works 2 points 19 hours ago

It's not a foreign language in English speaking countries...

this post was submitted on 15 Feb 2026
1062 points (99.3% liked)

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