this post was submitted on 27 Apr 2025
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[–] [email protected] -4 points 3 days ago (4 children)

100 ping? you seriously can't play with a tenth of a second ping time? Sounds like you're a shitty gamer making excuses

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 days ago (1 children)

In some games it is genuinely unplayable. This is coming from someone with on average 200+ ping with spikes up to 600 sometimes.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I guess I don't really play any games where that tiny difference in ping time matters THAT much...That's less time than most people can even measure without tools

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago

Would matter in pretty much any game where one player's actions can affect the other player and position is important.

SA:MP back in the day had such shit netcode you had to shoot a significant distance ahead of a running player or nothing would happen to them. It was the shot receicing player's client that had to detect the shot. In games where the server determines what happened to you, 100ms means there's 100 milliseconds where you don't even know you're dead. That said, unless you're playing competitive, 100ms is still borderline okay. Near 200 it's horrible already.

Now something like a game of Civ? You could have an entire second and be OK.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago (2 children)

If the person shooting you has 30ms ping, I'd say it's a significant advantage.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

To human perception a 0.1 seconds isn't much different than 0.03 seconds

I forgot if it was you I asked about this or not. But are you sure the one with slightly less ping time isn't just cheating?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

To human perception a 0.1 seconds isn’t much different than 0.03 seconds

You are making the mistake of thinking about reaction times. What matters much more in shooters is that our brain adjusts for the ping. That affects:

  • aiming with a lead of a few pixels. And in a fast moving environment, with skilled players, aiming for a lead of 30ms is absolutely a few pixels that can be targeted intentionally
  • the time between triggering a shot (nerve signal to the trigger finger) and the last chance that the target has to dodge / change direction -> in such games, players are rarely running in a straight line, and more often running preemptive zigzag / evasive maneuvers even when not getting shot at. 30ms more ping means that on every shot taken, you lose 30ms from the window in which your target still moves in the direction you thought it was moving. Even if the target only changes direction only once per second, that's 3% lost from the time window in which you can predict where to shoot. Actually more, because you have reaction time after a direction change, before you can even consider aiming.
  • furthermore, when a player with low ping gets hit by non-instant-kill ammo, they will dodge within their reaction time. Assuming the attacker chain-fires, they lose 30ms of ammo missing the target before they can adjust aim or stop firing
[–] [email protected] -5 points 3 days ago (2 children)

if a person shooting me has a lower ping and I get upset about it with a 100 ping I need to touch grass.

back in my day I played Halo with a 1300-2000 ping and still whipped ass.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 days ago

the lama's ass?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I don't believe you. An fps with ping as massive as over 1000 would be straight up unplayable

That's over a full second of delay! In an fps I routinely do split second maneuvers and reactions. If someone I was shooting at wouldn't be able to react to what I was doing for at least a full second, I would easily dominate them every single time

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 days ago (2 children)

believe it or not. this was early 2000s, so everyone outside of major cities had shitty internet.

I had the fastest connection in my small shit town at 1.5mbps.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I also don't believe you, and here's why:

Halo CE didn't have lag compensation, so with 2 seconds of latency you would have to lead your target by 2 seconds. Shooting anyone who wasn't standing still would be a complete guessing game - I think you too would also classify that as unplayable (source).

Halo 2 seems to not be well documented - it looks like it's using some form of rudimentary rollback, which can deal with higher latency but you'd need it very stable to avoid opponents teleporting constantly. It's also unclear if it would handle 2s of latency, as that would increase both CPU and memory utilization of servers. If you're getting a variance of 700ms as you claimed this most certainly wouldn't be playable. High ping being stable is also hard to believe, naturally the higher the latency the higher the absolute variance.

Halo 3 uses synchronous lockstep networking with a ~300ms window (source). If you're not in that window your actions are rejected, so quite literally unplayable at 2s. I think this is more evidence that bungie would've had a <2s maximum latency in their earlier title.

My best guess is you've either misremembered the latency (130-200ms is about what I'd expect from rural internet at that time), or you were playing peer-to-peer with your friends and so internet latency didn't matter. I myself have played plenty of multiplayer games at over 100 ping and while it can be annoying I'd certainly call it playable, but not 10x that.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

thanks for hyper analyzing.

it was Halo 1 on the original Xbox early 2000s.

oh wait, halo 1 on original Xbox didn't have Xbox live, right?

my friends and I would use a shared internet connection over our local PC with dual nics. software was running that would basically create a flat network VPN that would show us all as-if we on a LAN. think of it like xlink-kai before it was a thing. I can't remember the software name but we would use it for pc games like diablo, c&c, aoe, unreal, etc.

it was my idea to use it for Xbox with the network connection sharing on windows.

latency was a problem, but we still could play and it was enjoyable enough we'd do it weekly.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Sounds like great fun! We did the same thing to play battlefield 2 over LAN (If you played on LAN you could bypass the online DRM, as we only had one copy).

Yea Halo Combat Evolved (Halo 1) only had internet multiplayer on the PC version, but the Xbox version could do peer-to-peer multiplayer. One person would have zero ping as the host and the rest would go over the vpn. Any kind of latency would have been annoying due to Halo CE's lack of lag compensation :D

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I don't always get 1.5mbps now and 1000ping doesn't work in a shooter. Depends on the game, some will make you basically unable to move, sometimes you basically warp around visually and fuck all happens, sometimes it seems fine but you die to people that don't exist because you have a second of delay.

I was dealing with spikes of 2000 to 10000 ping yesterday on Minecraft and playable is not a word I would use to describe those spikes.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago

thresholds today and thresholds 20 years ago are vastly different.

my point was that it's possible to play a game even at "high" ping.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I think over 100 starts making your off-gcds clip on FFXIV, and stuff like getting 6 hits properly for Wildfire on MCH(probably some other stuff too). It's not unplayable, but it is frustrating and distracting, so can cause an ADHD person like me significant stress when doing content like Savage raids and Ultimates

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Final Fantasy 14? Don't know what MCH is, never heard of Wildfire

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Mch stands for Machinist, a ranged gun class in FF14, and wildfire is an attack from said class that gets stronger the more hits you land during its duration. The max hits is 6, but enough lag and you can only get 5 of them off in the window. The game has a default 2.5 second global cool down between skills, though some gear and some skills can reduce that. In particular for Wildfire, you combine it with a skill that allows 5 hits of itself plus 1 other at 1.5s per cool down, but if you're adding another .1 to each of those it can add up to miss unless very tight on timing.

Not a game breaker, but if you're trying to push through your best performance because your group is failing at 1-2% you can't really help not being mad at it.

Edit: in addition, the frustration isn't you personally dying in some pvp, but your group of 8 friends you're also holding back on fights. In addition to lowering damage, deaths can wear down your healers mp(and significantly lower your own damage output) so some tight mechanics can be harder to react, especially if your brain has you move wrong at first. None of these by themselves are terrible, but over the course of 3 hours working at clearing multiple fights it can wear you out and kill your enjoyment.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago

Edit: in addition, the frustration isn’t you personally dying in some pvp, but your group of 8 friends you’re also holding back on fights. In addition to lowering damage, deaths can wear down your healers mp(and significantly lower your own damage output) so some tight mechanics can be harder to react, especially if your brain has you move wrong at first. None of these by themselves are terrible, but over the course of 3 hours working at clearing multiple fights it can wear you out and kill your enjoyment.

I don't even do PVP in anything anymore. It's too stressful to be the only one who's trying to win while the other team is a group of friends that are full of gear I can't get. Between that and the people who actually cheat to win, I just can't do it anymore.

How do I know they cheat? because my attacks registered with a pretty high amount of damage and their health didn't go down even one bit. Other times, the same attacks with the same character will wipe out each enemy player I attack and it requires the entire other team to focus on just me for me to die

I like to play as stealth classes and I'm good at going to places most people don't check, you should see how I play Gmod prop hunt. I'm great at it

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

As an amateur, in a fast paced shooter, vs. an equally skilled player, it went from a fair match with equal pings to one player dominating the other with 100 vs. 70 ping.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

that little of a difference really matters? Are you sure that the one with a tiny bit less ping isn't just cheating?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Yes, that little of a difference absolutely matters, proven by the observation that it went both ways. I could become the clear winner, or my opponent, based on who had the lower ping, whereas in equal ping settings the games were much more balanced. It's easy to tell when you regularly play against the same people.

That's how fast paced shooters work. Don't think about the crap that people sell as "shooters" nowadays which is adjusted to playstation controllers or similar BS.

Think quake, unreal tournament, quake arena, openarena.