▲ 351 ▼ ‘Sovereign citizen’ shot, killed during exchange with Harris County deputies (www.houstonpublicmedia.org) submitted 2 years ago by BonesOfTheMoon@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world 75 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] Fedizen@lemmy.world 105 points 2 years ago (2 children) woman bystander shot... They can't fucking just shoot each other and leave everyone else out of it. permalink fedilink source hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] FilterItOut 51 points 2 years ago (5 children) Hopefully it brings consequences. Every time a bullet is fired, it is required (and I guess that must be in quotes for police officers...) that you be responsible for that bullet's consequences. If you shoot at a legitimate threat, but hit the bystander, you should get charged. Cop, not-cop, firefighter, good samaritan with a gun, whatever. Charge them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] foggy@lemmy.world 49 points 2 years ago yes, should. This, however, is America. Land of the free policeman. Home of the not brave policeman. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 28 points 2 years ago Hopefully it brings consequences. I'm sure it will. The cops will be put on paid leave and then given medals. Something like that. That's what usually happens when cops kill innocent people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago (2 children) In many jurisdictions if anyone is hurt related to a crime, the criminal is legally responsible for all damages. So for a situation like this, the criminal would be responsible for all damages stemming from their initial crime when they chose to run. Any damage in the chase or subsequent actions until they are killed or in custody. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 15 points 2 years ago (1 child) Yes, and that should be the case. However, cops (and everyone for that matter) should be responsible for every shot they fire. They should make sure their background is clear. If some freak accident happens, like a ricochet that shouldn't be expected, then it should be fine, but they should have to make an attempt to be safe with firearms. You know a civilian would have to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) IDK if it should be the case, because that shit is getting abused to jail people who shouldn't be jailed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one 4 points 2 years ago It's called "Felony Murder". https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/12/18/felony-murder-laws permalink fedilink source parent [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 years ago (1 child) It is more likely that she be arrested for obstruction because she intercepted the bullet. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] BolexForSoup@kbin.social 1 point 2 years ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) In America, automatically sue them civilly by the State for lost wages, mercenary healthcare costs, any permanent impairment risks; everything. Your "good Samaritan with a gun" (read: dude who failed his cop exam for reasons) needs to get some insurance or his life will get very different if he maims someone with his civilian-level firearms training. Fuck it. Charge the vigilantes with a crime if they even draw their firearm (manacing) or fire it (noise/assault/threatening/attempted murder) so they Get It. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (1 child) civilian-level firearms training You're implying the cops are getting better training. Hint: they don't permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Case@lemmynsfw.com 6 points 2 years ago* Lived next door to a cop, and down the street from another while growing up. My dad, who only went with his father, trained more often and more rigorously then they did. How do I know? Cops talk a lotta shit, and their kids are sick of fascism already. This was only up until like 6th grade even. Cop down the street was known for beating his wife, and was probably dirty as hell with the drive by attempt. Thankfully none of the kids were hurt. No one else was either, but even then I wouldn't have shed a tear for a pig. permalink fedilink source parent [–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago The only thing that will stop a bad sovereign citizen with a gun is a good sovereign citizen with a gun. A pity that there are no sovereign citizens that should ever be trusted with anything as dangerous as a pair of arts and crafts scissors for kindergarteners permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FilterItOut 51 points 2 years ago (5 children) Hopefully it brings consequences. Every time a bullet is fired, it is required (and I guess that must be in quotes for police officers...) that you be responsible for that bullet's consequences. If you shoot at a legitimate threat, but hit the bystander, you should get charged. Cop, not-cop, firefighter, good samaritan with a gun, whatever. Charge them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] foggy@lemmy.world 49 points 2 years ago yes, should. This, however, is America. Land of the free policeman. Home of the not brave policeman. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 28 points 2 years ago Hopefully it brings consequences. I'm sure it will. The cops will be put on paid leave and then given medals. Something like that. That's what usually happens when cops kill innocent people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago (2 children) In many jurisdictions if anyone is hurt related to a crime, the criminal is legally responsible for all damages. So for a situation like this, the criminal would be responsible for all damages stemming from their initial crime when they chose to run. Any damage in the chase or subsequent actions until they are killed or in custody. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 15 points 2 years ago (1 child) Yes, and that should be the case. However, cops (and everyone for that matter) should be responsible for every shot they fire. They should make sure their background is clear. If some freak accident happens, like a ricochet that shouldn't be expected, then it should be fine, but they should have to make an attempt to be safe with firearms. You know a civilian would have to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) IDK if it should be the case, because that shit is getting abused to jail people who shouldn't be jailed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one 4 points 2 years ago It's called "Felony Murder". https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/12/18/felony-murder-laws permalink fedilink source parent [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 years ago (1 child) It is more likely that she be arrested for obstruction because she intercepted the bullet. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] BolexForSoup@kbin.social 1 point 2 years ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) In America, automatically sue them civilly by the State for lost wages, mercenary healthcare costs, any permanent impairment risks; everything. Your "good Samaritan with a gun" (read: dude who failed his cop exam for reasons) needs to get some insurance or his life will get very different if he maims someone with his civilian-level firearms training. Fuck it. Charge the vigilantes with a crime if they even draw their firearm (manacing) or fire it (noise/assault/threatening/attempted murder) so they Get It. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (1 child) civilian-level firearms training You're implying the cops are getting better training. Hint: they don't permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Case@lemmynsfw.com 6 points 2 years ago* Lived next door to a cop, and down the street from another while growing up. My dad, who only went with his father, trained more often and more rigorously then they did. How do I know? Cops talk a lotta shit, and their kids are sick of fascism already. This was only up until like 6th grade even. Cop down the street was known for beating his wife, and was probably dirty as hell with the drive by attempt. Thankfully none of the kids were hurt. No one else was either, but even then I wouldn't have shed a tear for a pig. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] foggy@lemmy.world 49 points 2 years ago yes, should. This, however, is America. Land of the free policeman. Home of the not brave policeman. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 28 points 2 years ago Hopefully it brings consequences. I'm sure it will. The cops will be put on paid leave and then given medals. Something like that. That's what usually happens when cops kill innocent people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago (2 children) In many jurisdictions if anyone is hurt related to a crime, the criminal is legally responsible for all damages. So for a situation like this, the criminal would be responsible for all damages stemming from their initial crime when they chose to run. Any damage in the chase or subsequent actions until they are killed or in custody. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 15 points 2 years ago (1 child) Yes, and that should be the case. However, cops (and everyone for that matter) should be responsible for every shot they fire. They should make sure their background is clear. If some freak accident happens, like a ricochet that shouldn't be expected, then it should be fine, but they should have to make an attempt to be safe with firearms. You know a civilian would have to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) IDK if it should be the case, because that shit is getting abused to jail people who shouldn't be jailed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one 4 points 2 years ago It's called "Felony Murder". https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/12/18/felony-murder-laws permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 15 points 2 years ago (1 child) Yes, and that should be the case. However, cops (and everyone for that matter) should be responsible for every shot they fire. They should make sure their background is clear. If some freak accident happens, like a ricochet that shouldn't be expected, then it should be fine, but they should have to make an attempt to be safe with firearms. You know a civilian would have to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) IDK if it should be the case, because that shit is getting abused to jail people who shouldn't be jailed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) IDK if it should be the case, because that shit is getting abused to jail people who shouldn't be jailed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 point 2 years ago I haven't really heard of that being abused. They have easier ways to do that. I wouldn't be surprised if it's abused, but if you start a car chase you should be responsible for what happens with it, for example. I guess I can see the potential for abuse, but also I think it's necessary to have. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ShaggySnacks@lemmy.myserv.one 4 points 2 years ago It's called "Felony Murder". https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/12/18/felony-murder-laws permalink fedilink source parent
[–] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 years ago (1 child) It is more likely that she be arrested for obstruction because she intercepted the bullet. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] BolexForSoup@kbin.social 1 point 2 years ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) In America, automatically sue them civilly by the State for lost wages, mercenary healthcare costs, any permanent impairment risks; everything. Your "good Samaritan with a gun" (read: dude who failed his cop exam for reasons) needs to get some insurance or his life will get very different if he maims someone with his civilian-level firearms training. Fuck it. Charge the vigilantes with a crime if they even draw their firearm (manacing) or fire it (noise/assault/threatening/attempted murder) so they Get It. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (1 child) civilian-level firearms training You're implying the cops are getting better training. Hint: they don't permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Case@lemmynsfw.com 6 points 2 years ago* Lived next door to a cop, and down the street from another while growing up. My dad, who only went with his father, trained more often and more rigorously then they did. How do I know? Cops talk a lotta shit, and their kids are sick of fascism already. This was only up until like 6th grade even. Cop down the street was known for beating his wife, and was probably dirty as hell with the drive by attempt. Thankfully none of the kids were hurt. No one else was either, but even then I wouldn't have shed a tear for a pig. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (1 child) civilian-level firearms training You're implying the cops are getting better training. Hint: they don't permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Case@lemmynsfw.com 6 points 2 years ago* Lived next door to a cop, and down the street from another while growing up. My dad, who only went with his father, trained more often and more rigorously then they did. How do I know? Cops talk a lotta shit, and their kids are sick of fascism already. This was only up until like 6th grade even. Cop down the street was known for beating his wife, and was probably dirty as hell with the drive by attempt. Thankfully none of the kids were hurt. No one else was either, but even then I wouldn't have shed a tear for a pig. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Case@lemmynsfw.com 6 points 2 years ago* Lived next door to a cop, and down the street from another while growing up. My dad, who only went with his father, trained more often and more rigorously then they did. How do I know? Cops talk a lotta shit, and their kids are sick of fascism already. This was only up until like 6th grade even. Cop down the street was known for beating his wife, and was probably dirty as hell with the drive by attempt. Thankfully none of the kids were hurt. No one else was either, but even then I wouldn't have shed a tear for a pig. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago The only thing that will stop a bad sovereign citizen with a gun is a good sovereign citizen with a gun. A pity that there are no sovereign citizens that should ever be trusted with anything as dangerous as a pair of arts and crafts scissors for kindergarteners permalink fedilink source parent