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So I was just banned from /c/unpopularopinion for posting an unpopular opinion (lemmus.org)
submitted 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) by to c/yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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I don't even know who the mod is, or why they didn't contact me. They just removed my post with a single word - "troll". How rude! I guess my opinions are too unpopular even for Lemmy 🫪

Edit: The power tripping bastard who sniped me was /u/JonsJava.

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[–] 2 points 9 hours ago

Guess we gonna need a c/trueunpopularopinion now

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    [–] 2 points 11 hours ago*

    1. I unironically agree with everything in your OP except for the part of Apple being the worst company. I don't see them as noticeably worse than em-dollar sign or any other big tech company.

    2. Plenty of people feel strongly enough about the merits or lack thereof of certain programming languages to the point where they would reject projects developed or not developed in said language. "I refuse to use apps that has AI code" isn't that different from people complaining about the rustification of Linux.

    3. I honestly don't know whether you're being pro-AI or anti-AI lol

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    [–] 23 points 1 day ago (5 children)

    Mod logs are a thing, but it was me

    Your post:

    You then start acting obtuse (most of those comments are still on your profile, so I won't rehash)

    What made me realize you were just trolling was this:

    One user said

    What about a carpenter who uses Parkside or Ryobi power tools? Why would I buy a kitchen table from a guy who uses interior tools? I think a carpenter should use something nicer like Makita tools.

    which was their way to express how silly your point of view was. You replied with

    Exactly! I've made that same exact argument in the past.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 day ago

    LOL. Thanks. Also, sorry… I have mixed feelings about the result my comment had.

    Anyway, I wanted to add a few things about that. Quality of the output is only vaguely associated with the tools you use. Quality mainly comes from the user. Nicer tools will make it easier to reach the level of quality you’re aiming for, but even low-quality tools can produce a high-quality output. It’ll just take more time and effort.

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  • [+] [S] -8 points 1 day ago (3 children)

    My client, Connect for Android, doesn't expose that information so thank you for identifying.

    Yes, I HAVE made that exact argument in the past, to show how silly I think the whole AI discrimination argument is. I don't get how that's being a troll. I really don't.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 day ago* (2 children)
    • I banned you 31 minutes ago.
    • You messaged me 20 minutes ago.
    • You posted this 24 minute ago.

    With that being said, Text doesn't convey intention or emotions, sadly. With that said, your reasoning (which I was unaware of) does change the context.

    I still have a strong feeling that the opinion is a troll post, but I will restore.

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  • [–] [S] -4 points 1 day ago*

    I just woke up. Checked Lemmy, as it's my only social media, replied cordially to everyone who took the time to reply to my opinion, and then noticed the post said "removed" at the top. I checked modlog, it said I was banned with only the word "troll" so I posted here. Then I saw a new reply to my post, and based on your comment I assumed you were the person who had banned me, messaged you, and updated this post - that probably reset the post time to being after the message.

    Thank you for being reasonable. The inability to read intention or emotion is why I make the (also unpopular) intentional use of emojii. I'm AuDHD, so I'm used to being misunderstood, but I'm really not attempting to anger people with my opinions. I admit they are always very unpopular, universally, which is why I was surprised it didn't have any upvotes. Not that they mean anything, but it does imply others think I'm a troll, too, not just you.. However, If I stop posting on /c/unpopularopinion then I effectively no longer have any online presence at all. Maybe reality would be better off without my contributions in any form 😑

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    • [–] 8 points 1 day ago (13 children)

    Troll

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 day ago (11 children)

    Maybe I just don't know what a troll is, despite watching several South Park episodes on the topic. I was under the impression that a troll purposefully tries to stir shit up for the purpose of aggravating others. That's not what I was doing. I was posting my sincere opinion, unpopular though it might be, because I hate Apple with the same fervency that most Lemmy users hate AI.

    Is that being a troll in your view?

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  • [–] 8 points 1 day ago

    because I hate Apple

    This is Lemmy. Corporate hate must be limited to Meta, Amazon, Microsoft and OpenAI.

    Microsoft is to be attacked for bundling a browser. But Apple, with a greater marketshare of Internet users, must be allowed to have a complete monopoly on what browser you have installed.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (9 children)

    Not to speak to the ban particularly, but to your original proposal. I think the distinction of AI vs other tools is that AI is used as a substitute for human work where other tools are simply used by the developer in their craft.

    I recently got a fully automatic espresso machine that grinds and processes the whole works. If by some miracle chance it could make a better pour than the local barista it's not me by any stretch that's owed the credit for the output, the machine would be. That's where the AI = tool concept breaks down.

    I suspect a better post for an unpopular opinion might be "it's unessecary to label AI generated code because..." rather than "we should foist some absurd requirement on everything that could be extended logically to an infinate level of where and when the silicon for their chips was souced"

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  • [–] [S] -1 points 1 day ago (6 children)

    I would disagree. It's not like the tool is working of it's own volition, in a vacuum. There's still a person there; instigating, directing and reviewing. Scoff if you're so inclined, but "prompt engineering" is a real skill with measurable impact on the quality of the result.

    The fully automatic espresso machine, therefore, is not a good analogy. You load the coffee and press the button. It doesn't matter how hard you push the button, or from which angle. You don't direct the machine as it requires clarification, and once the coffee is made you can't in any way change the outcome. It's wholly different from using AI as a tool.

    I'm a realist, and recognize the sentiment of anti-AI consumers isn't going away in the next decade. It's already implemented, and I'm not going to attempt to argue it should be removed - instead, continue the thought and implement it thoroughly, rather than isolate the scrutiny to a single tool in the chain.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago (5 children)

    By that token I would play the role of the user by deciding the beans, the water, and the fineness of the grind, but the machine did the rest by actually initiating the actions, tamping the beans, pressing the water and determining the length of time. My input is a trivial part of the machine's output, similar to selecting a model and (if within your control) setting some sampling parameters. At best you're providing educated guesses into guiding the output.

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  • [–] [S] -2 points 22 hours ago (4 children)

    Fair enough. So if you chose bad beans, ground them poorly, and used dirty water - you are responsible for how the coffee turned out, no? So you can't attribute the quality entirely to the machine that simply heated up the water and poured it over the grounds. In both cases it's a team effort; the better the user, and the better the machine, the better the outcome.

    I still believe you have more control over the final product in using AI, though, because you decide when it matches the vision directing you to make whatever it is you're making. The coffee machine is one shot, unless you're going to continually pour out the pot and try again until the quality matches your aim.

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  • [–] 3 points 22 hours ago (3 children)

    Nothing in the physical and digital realms is directly analogous, that's been discussed to death since the original Napster era.

    The comparison in my mind is more about the competance of the person involved. In either case with AI or an automated coffe machine any average person could viably manage passable output. Take the tool away though and a large portion of those same people wouldn't know where to start. In those cases the machine is primarily responsible for the output. It's also likely that the output is in some way sub-optimal. To claim 'I made this' when, stripped of the automated machine the user would be helpless, is dishonest.

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  • [–] [S] -1 points 21 hours ago (2 children)

    I would agree with you on it being down to the competence of the person involved in the process. However, if you were to take these qualifications and apply them to other professions then I think you would find few, if any, of them actually exist.

    Like how many architects can design massive structures without CAD? How many physicists can do quantum mechanics without the machines that enable particle collision? How many astronomers can study the cosmos without their telescope? How many accountants can balance the books of corporations without a computer?

    Yes, AI enables people to do things that they otherwise wouldn't be able to do, but that's why it's such an incredible innovation! I understand that Lemmy is comprised of people who feel strongly that they alone are deserving of creation because of the amount of study, practice and effort they've put into their skills, but disparaging others because it's become easier feels like gatekeeping. I think it should be celebrated that more people can share in my passion for software development, not upset that my skills are essentially trivialized.

    Maybe this is truly, deep down, an expression of ego?

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  • [–] 3 points 20 hours ago (1 child)

    How many of the same would an unskilled amateur be able to produce comparable results from?

    If the user doesn't understand the work being done then at some point the skill is lost. If every coder alive simply stopped their studies then in order to properly know what was being output from the AI we would essentially need to reinvent the wheel.

    Offloading human skills into a machine owned by a small group of absurdly wealthy individuals risks dependence on them. Long before AI systems existed we passed on skills and knowledge from master to apprentance (or whatever title is appropriate to a field) with the master supervising and correcting the work of the new workers. Forgoing that passage of learning by simply asking for a given result from a machine... I picture the scene from Idiocracy where a clerk is selecting from a picture menu at the hospital.

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  • [–] [S] 0 points 20 hours ago

    You're not wrong, at all. The only correction I'd like to make it that no one is beholden to use the machines owned by the absurdly wealthy. I much prefer to use the open weight models on local hardware. It's a privilege that I relish.

    We should have apprenticeships. We should have on the job training. We should have a lot of things, but we don't. Barring a complete overhaul of society I don't see any of that changing. Pandora's Box isn't closing , and the genie isn't going back into the bottle. Instead, we have to deal with reality as it is, so I embrace it rather than fight it, and make the most of it.

    We were headed towards Idiocracy long before the advent of AI.

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    • [–] 3 points 1 day ago

    Kind of off topic, but I completely agree with your stance and I think it protrarys an uncomfortable truth for people who constantly attack AI. It truly isn't not different than other technologies/tools we've had over time. Other tech has stolen from its predecessors. Other tech has threatened to destroy jobs (and has). AI is not unique in this but merely the topic du jour.

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    [–] 8 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    It’s probably the terminally online vibes you give off.

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  • [–] [S] -2 points 1 day ago

    I mean, I've been online for over three decades, am a software engineer and Lemmy is the only social media I use - so "terminally online" is apt. I guess I didn't realize that's a bannable offense.

    I do try to touch grass, literally, at least once a day. Does that count for anything?

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    • [–] 2 points 1 day ago*

    PTB. The focus on "AI" just feeds the grift and provides cover for the actual humans doing evil shit since forever. It's not trolling to point this out. I've been banned from fuck_ai for similar comments. The "anti-AI" movement is part of the problem. I started the_big_lai to highlight this nonsense.

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