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88% of US voters say a driver’s license should be an acceptable form of photo ID if photo ID is required for voting (ballotpedia.org)

submitted 2 months ago by Innerworld@lemmy.world to c/sociology@mander.xyz

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[-] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 82 points 2 months ago

Only if every eligible voter is given such an ID free of charge in an expedient manner. Otherwise, it's effectively an illegal poll tax.

[-] Catoblepas@piefed.blahaj.zone 45 points 2 months ago

You will be given an ID in an expedient manner, as soon as you come to the 1 DMV in your county that serves 100,000 people and wait 12 hours in line on a weekday.

-Alabama

[-] Pavidus@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago

Too true. Last year I needed a license and decided to get the star id. I tried every Monday from January to May before I gave up.

[-] WoodScientist@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

When I lived in Texas, I lived in Houston, a large and racially diverse city. I found the best way to get drivers license services timely was to drive out of the cities to a primarily white rural town. Suddenly there were no more giant lines.

Jim Crow never died. He just chilled out a bit and got better marketing.

[-] defaultusername@lemmy.dbzer0.com 48 points 2 months ago

But that was never the point of requiring ID to vote. It has always been about voter supression.

[-] morkyporky@suppo.fi -1 points 1 month ago

So every country other than the US is supressing votes?

[-] mbfalzar@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 month ago

Don't most of those countries provide an acceptable form of ID? Rather than the $30-70 cost for compliant IDs in the US

[-] morkyporky@suppo.fi 2 points 1 month ago

I picked Germany at random and an ID to vote costs 46 € for an adult. Voter ID is not controversial.

[-] pez@piefed.blahaj.zone 2 points 1 month ago

Germany allows fees to be waived for people in financial need. Not clear how common that is from my searches, but their FAQs all seem to mention the option.

I think most people wouldn't mind ID requirements if they're implemented far enough in advance of any election, readily available, and free for anyone on a financial assistance program.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com -5 points 1 month ago

In the US "black people can't get IDs" or something so "racist."

Never mind that every single black person I've ever known has had an ID (not necessarily a drivers license but a valid ID) and you need the ID for many things in every day life so they basically have to have one and I doubt the premise but also "black people can't get IDs" sounds a little savior complex-y to me and may itself be racist.

[-] dmention7@midwest.social 8 points 1 month ago

In the US "black people can't get IDs"

Nice strawman. But the simple fact is that people of color (and younger people) are less likely to have a photo OD, for a variety of reasons from cost to lack of daily utility for one.

Even if you naively assume that equal proportions of older whiter people, and younger non-white people will pick up an ID solely to vote, it means that instituting an ID requirement to vote will cause more younger people and people of color to be ineligible to vote.

All to solve a "problem" that even the most motivated groups have been unable to show exists.

Make the ID free and/or subsidized, minimize the time/travel burden to get one, and provide a generous roll-in period like we did for REAL ID, and the problem largely goes away. If the government is going to require an ID to exercise your most basic rights, the barrier to that ID needs to be as low as possible.

[+] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com -6 points 1 month ago

Except you need one for having jobs, to drive, to buy 21+ stuff, things many people need to do daily, and to buy guns, to get into concerts and such, gambling which is popular on the phones now I guess, etc. I've had one since I was 14 and needed it (and a work permit) to get my first job (and the DMV near me is/was in a black neighborhood no less), I think they can handle it without the grace of White Saviors (or maybe I just really am that special, which I doubt.) And while I'm on it, if requiring an ID for voting is prohibitive to black people and thus restricts their right to vote, then same goes for guns and their right to bear arms.

Older ~~white~~ people have an ID because they've needed it almost daily for X yr since they turned ~14-16, at most 18, maybe 21 if they're really lucky and didn't have to work or drive because they're Princess Diana or whatever. Young ~~black~~ people have to get one because they're turning 14-16. Literally every single person I've ever known above those ages regardless of race or proximity to a DMV has had one, because you need it, even if it's not a "drivers license" or is revoked under some other provision (like some I know who've had DUIs).

I don't necessarily disagree with your methods to "fix" it, fine do that, but I still doubt the premise that black people are incapable of getting (or are otherwise able to actively participate in society without) an ID. Even the homeless alcoholics who live under the bridge who I drink with sometimes, they have IDs. None of them can vote because they're all felons, but they have IDs. And one of them is black! Sure they mainly use it for 40ozers of Mickey's at the gas station, but still they possess IDs.

I have the real solution though (at least while we're doing your idea we can do this too, which I think is more effective at enticing people to do boring clerical shit): bring ages of fun shit back to 18. Wanna drink/smoke/vape/^vote ? Get you one of these here IDs.

[-] joshisanonymous@h4.io 1 points 1 month ago

@ArcaneSlime @dmention7 There is evidence that minority groups are less likely to have IDs, but the results of ID requirements appear to be mainly reduced participation by all groups and only disproportionately reduced participation by Latinxs. (Disclaimer: I don't know if this is a robust result or only this one study.)

Darrah-Okike, J., Rita, N., & Logan, J. R. (2021). The Suppressive Impacts of Voter Identification Requirements. Sociological Perspectives, 64(4), 536–562.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com -2 points 1 month ago

And yet it works in most other countries, including 46 out of 47 European countries? The US is one of the few outliers in the world that does not require it, most do, and you're telling me nobody in most of the world votes?

And "latinx?" These countries also all have voter ID already (though those countries also hate the term "latinx"):

Barbados Belize Costa Rica Cuba Dominican Republic El Salvador Guatemala Haiti Honduras Jamaica Mexico Nicaragua Panama Trinidad and Tobago Argentina Bolivia Brazil Chile Colombia Ecuador Guyana Paraguay Peru Suriname Uruguay Venezuela

Copied and pasted list, I know some of those aren't "latinx" but I gotta run so no time to prune.

[-] joshisanonymous@h4.io 1 points 1 month ago

@ArcaneSlime Other countries that have the same exact ID and voting systems would probably be similarly impacted. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove in reference to the study I shared.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

My point is partially that voter ID is only controversial in the US, in the entire rest of the world it is "of course you use ID for voting, how else would you prevent fraud?"

Also "I still doubt the premise." I carpool with a friend of mine to work daily, good dude. I asked him if he has ever known anyone at all (hadn't even gotten to "black" yet, I asked "anyone") without an ID and he immediately launched into "See man I hate that bullshit, yes we can get IDs and we all have one, that is some racist bullshit but from the other side that pretends they care. Actually I didn't get mine until I was 18, and my friends made fun of me when we were 16-17. It's fucked up that they see me and assume I can't get one." (He didn't think I thought that myself, I was clear that I was arguing with some white savior types and wasn't sure if I was off base or if you were, so we're good him and I). So, unless you're blacker than my friend here I'm gonna trust whoever can say the N-word on this one.

You can cite papers as if they're all automatically sound (meanwhile many papers are done a specific way to engineer results, like the "weed kills brain cells" study for example), but until I meet ONE, count 'em ONE, person who is a legal citizen able to get an ID who does not have one, I'm not gonna believe it's common at all. I know another literal homeless dude outside of the aforementioned camp of 3, and that dude also has an ID, and he's also black (like one of the aforementioned 3). Literally not ONE person I know regardless of skin color or economic situation has no ID. I'm not opposed to making them free yadda yadda all your ideas earlier (though tbf Germany charges more than the US does and their Voter ID laws aren't controversial), but I still don't think black people and legal "latinx" (sorry Latin people I didn't say it he did I know y'all hate that) residents can't get an ID as is commonly touted, and I still hold that assuming POC can't get ID is racist (which turns out my black co-worker friend there agrees, so I'm on the right track). POC are just as capable as white people dude, it's 2026, they can drive now it isn't 1850.

[-] joshisanonymous@h4.io 1 points 1 month ago

@ArcaneSlime (You seem to be mixing me up with someone else.) In any case, it's normal to doubt a premise if it doesn't match your personal experience, but denying data because it doesn't match your anecdotes isn't reasonable, even less so is denying inconvenient studies under the assumption that all inconvenient studies are fraudulent. Unless you can point out what's specifically wrong with the study I cited, I'm going to believe its results over your anecdotes.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 month ago

Unfortunately I'm not in the business of paying Jstor for papers, but the abstract has a lot of "may limit"s and "However, past studies have reported conflicting results"s before coming to the conclusion that it indeed suppresses votes (though not telling me how for free, of course, and doesn't offer any information about those conflicting studies. Were they done wrong or was this one? Only someone willing to pay can know).

And yet still I've never met anyone who didn't have an ID, and I don't even live in a voter ID state btw just one with people who need to live a normal life and to do so they must have an ID post- (and in many cases pre-) 18. Not only that but the POC I know so far (asked two now) all tell me it's racist to assume POC can't get IDs and everyone they know (who can legally get one) has one too. I'm also not in the business of developing racist thought processes because it makes some white guy feel good to help the noble savages, so I'm still gonna listen to the experiences of the POC I know when they tell me they indeed are just as capable of going to the DMV as any white person.

[-] joshisanonymous@h4.io 1 points 1 month ago

@ArcaneSlime I'd be happy to send you the paper (or there are other ways you can get it if you check into a "hub" of "sci"ence.)

The point of acknowledging conflicts in previous work is to explain the need for the current work. That doesn't mean the current work doesn't clarify the issue.

More importantly, the results of the study suggest voter suppression for all groups and only more notably for Latinxs despite previous research showing that minorities do have more difficulty getting IDs.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 month ago

Well if I can find it I'll look into it, but then again if the study says it doesn't disproportionately affect POC then it agrees with me on that part.

I still however don't know one single white adult without an ID either, you already need it for more than voting, and I can't see how showing the thing you literally carry in your pocket or purse 24/7 out of necessity already suppresses all votes either. I'm one of the paranoid assholes that hates identifying myself on every website and at every store just so I can get a big mac or an online service, I obscure my identity as much as humanly possible, I hate AI, facial recognition, ALPRs, Flock, 2fa through text, I don't even fly I take trains instead despite the inconvenience just because of all the invasive TSA horse shit (and maybe a little of "flying scary," I'll admit lol), and I STILL wouldn't even give a second thought about having to show ID to vote. Hell, when I do vote and they just ask my name and check me off the list, I'm tempted to drive to my non-voting friend's neighborhood and vote as/for him every time (I never have, but there's literally nothing but my own morality stopping me from acquiescing to temptation), but that also gives me the thought of "I cannot be the first person to think of that, hope nobody does it to me one day lol." Bro my polling place doesn't even have cameras, it'd literally be impossible to catch me, I couldn't do it on a mass scale of course but I could 100% do it and someone could 100% do it to me, all they need is my name and publically listed address.

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

What do the 12% say it should be other than “disagree”?

[-] fallaciousBasis@lemmy.world 3 points 1 month ago

We clearly need rectal tomography scans.

[-] ConstantPain@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

We have ID even on the phone and can vote with our fingerprint.

This is a solved issue.

this post was submitted on 08 Apr 2026

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