solarpunk memes

yeah, it was only when we added in paychecks they became police.

a) isn't "the police" just a wider definition of "a community organizing itself"

b) half the police are in the fucking klan anyway lol

If a society is a the point of calling for a substitute to police, then you are fucked. at that point you are just gonna build two armed factions which are illegitimate in each others eyes. thats how you get a civil war.

Modern police forces are what we decided to do with the slave catchers and mercenaries for hire that would have started gangs if the government didn't put them to work.

You can't draw blood from a stone. If community self-organizing gets you the KKK, that community was fucked to begin with. The USA has always been extremely racist, it's a matter of to what extent we give the racist police a legal monopoly on violence and place them above the law. At least when they wear ghost outfits you don't have an illusion of reasonability.

Also note that the KKK never aimed to replace the police for the community the KKK came from, but rather to build upon police oppression of people outside the community. The two situations are not analogous, and if KKK members had to police their own community they would be much more gentle and constructive in their methods.

As a minimum, how about frequent rotation and a sortition + selection system to staff the squads?

Imaginary example:

Two "cops" are needed for a term of 90 days (side note: in this hypothetical society, it could be that a cop is not a first responder but an investigator - first responders may be selected by proximity to the event and called up using some automated emergency messaging system). An investigator is allowed to request expert assistance from outside their department and often does.

At first, 10 candidates are sortitioned at random. Out of them, 3 refuse the job for various reasons, 7 go through instruction and pass evaluation. Out of them, 3 either step out during training or fail exams, 4 complete exams. Among them, another round of sortition occurs: 2 are selected at random, while 2 are paid compensation for study and assigned to reserve. If lottery chooses them again, they won't need to pass exams.

This might be possible to enhance with other tricks. If feedback shows that cops cannot be impartial near their home, then they don't work near their home. If however, feedback shows that they perform best near their home, then the opposite way.

The main goals this would aim to achieve:

• ensure that corruption will not start
• ensure that investigation is not biased (or that chances exist of bias being quickly exposed)
• ensure that offices cannot be given by people in power to whom they prefer
• ensure that competence is valued and unqualified bozos won't be appointed

We already have that. Cops with qualified immunity are almost definitionally an unregulated militia

Or the meth making bikers with the enormous pile of firearms decide they want to run the county. Jan 6 happened because one side was absolutely not afraid to use violence and another side wanted to play fair and by the rules.

Never underestimate the capacity of assholes to be assholes.

It’s called the local police

if they hadn't started school breakfast programs i (decades later) wouldn't have had food as a kid

I can also see community "policing" in cities devolve into chaos as a bunch of petty kings pop up in every neighbourhood.

The guys in those hypothetical lynch mobs are the cops today.

At least in this scenario you could get your buds and shoot back at the klan fuckers, maybe.

Amen. What I find fascinating and difficult to swallow is impoverished (and non) people's desire to have kids and not raise them, almost as if they are happy with their shit sandwich, and think "yeah" I'll give this to a another human. Boy o boy have I seen deplorables breed when they are in no capacity to look after themselves. It comes across to me as a type of evil. The meat grinder is made from this stupidity.

Agreed. It is multi step

You reduce the need for it, you reduce their military power. You give them better training and force them to use non lethal forces when possible (usually it is)

Stop breaking into people's houses incorrectly and shooting them

Also forced body cameras and strict follow up

Police should be needed less, but police still need to be policed by the people

Ive repeated this argument so many times.

1. They need to have a FEDERAL licence to provide law enforcement. So you cant just move when you get in trouble.

2. Each officer needs to carry their own "malpractice" insurance so the city/state doesnt have a financial interest in ignoring bad behavior.

3. Make "Abuse of the public trust" a federal felony. Officer making bad judgement calls in the heat of the moment is one thing but calculated corruption should be a federal offence.

I had an argument about this with a friend once. I was saying if we just abolish the police, private enterprise will probably step in to fill the gap. I don't want that. I don't want amazon offering policing services (as part of Prime. vomit).

I think the police need to be split up into smaller institutions, and have a lot less murder powers.

Someone needs to address the "Someone broke into my house and stole my TV" problem, without a profit motive and with accountability.

There should be something to address "My neighbor is screaming at his wife and I think he's hitting her" that doesn't involve some low empathy assholes with guns rolling up to mock the woman.

I don't know how to fix this.

Normally theyre called gangs. The thing that made the black panthers special is that as a cause it was killed before it deteriorated. A lot of gangs form to protect from other gangs, police corruption, and general sense of community.

Usually most folks aren't willing to do things free, so it devolves as it grows. Loses the original basis for formation. It's why christians is a confusing term, you have atheists, catholics, buddhists, etc. All lumped in while all can and are christian, there is degrees of severity.

I agree with you. What would be the use of those patrols if not to police behaviour?

Maybe someone with more historical knowledge could expand on the meaning of "Black Panther style community patrols".

You're putting the cart before the horse. It's not that the entire system needs to change for this to work, it's that this working changes the entire system. Community self-management would quickly result in the redistribution (and hopeful removal) of the inequalities, possibly with help of guillotines. The primary job of the police is to prevent this redistribution.

Historically, pretty much every "thriving local culture" is the result of a downtrodden wretched hive of scum and villainy where self-organisation was more important than police during the time of flourishing. Broadway (and NYC in general), New Orleans, Amsterdam, most Italian and German cities' high points, London, Hong Kong, Osaka, etc.. It turns out that when people don't have enough, they will work together to get enough, and the benefits of that cooperation can be felt in that town for centuries. (Which is why gentrification is profitable - rich people exploit the commons of a flourishing lower class mutual aid network which persist in the design and culture of the space even when the lower class people are gone).

That is, unless a violent organisation like the police or the CIA or a multinational corporation or an invading army forcefully breaks up that cooperation. Like happened when the US government funded drug gangs and arrested black panthers members to specifically break up black communities throughout the US. Or when the US government funded drug gangs and armed fascists to specifically break up socialist communities in central and south America. Or when the US government funded drug gang religious fanatics to break up communist communities in the middle east and South-East Asia.

holy shit my dude black panther style means irl black panthers from actual history not marvel movies ffs