this post was submitted on 06 Sep 2023
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Work Reform

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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.

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As part of his Labor Day message to workers in the United States, Sen. Bernie Sanders on Monday re-upped his call for the establishment of a 20% cut to the workweek with no loss in pay—an idea he said is "not radical" given the enormous productivity gains over recent decades that have resulted in massive profits for corporations but scraps for employees and the working class.

"It's time for a 32-hour workweek with no loss in pay," Sanders wrote in a Guardian op-ed as he cited a 480% increase in worker productivity since the 40-hour workweek was first established in 1940.

"It's time," he continued, "that working families were able to take advantage of the increased productivity that new technologies provide so that they can enjoy more leisure time, family time, educational and cultural opportunities—and less stress."

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[–] [email protected] 285 points 1 year ago (12 children)

Why does it feel like it’s only ever Bernie Sanders that is pushing for life improvements.

[–] [email protected] 147 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Cause he's one of the few that actually give a shit. Its why the DNC did everything in their power to scuttle his primary run. Can't have a president that actually wants to help the common American cause then the corporate overlords might lose their stranglehold on them.

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[–] [email protected] 83 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

TL;DR: Corruption and capitalism

Any kind of socialism (even relatively-speaking weak social democrats like Bernie) is severely underrepresented in US politics due to the influence of private money/capital in the government and in elections. The two party system/first past the post voting doesn't help matters either.

The people with money actively want to supress socialism by any means necessary. Look at Joe McCarthy and the Red Scare if you want an example in US history that still affects us today.

Also Reagan with deregulation and Bill Clinton with "triangulation" (effectively becoming more economically right wing by finding the middle ground between right and left, while the right is constantly pushing right. See: the Ratchet Effect)

Bernie is one of the extremely few principled politicians who doesn't take corporate money, but he also lacks power as he is one person.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Any kind of socialism (even relatively-speaking weak social democrats like Bernie)

This move is not socialism and calling it socialism makes it harder to pass in America.

If you're in a gun fight, don't start tossing your opponent ammunition.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Thank you

We've already proven that idiots don't understand the words they parrot, so attaching it to one they hate is just stupid.

Same thing with shit like vaccines and autism. Don't even put the two in the same sentence. It's not even worth legitimizing the bullshit the handlers put out there

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Why does it feel like it's only ever Bernie Sanders that is pushing to bring the US inline with Europe?

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[–] [email protected] 165 points 1 year ago (8 children)

That’s simply not possible, I need my employees to be working more hours, not less. Last year I could barely afford my sailing trip to Aruba. If such a law passes I’m going to have to fire some people for sure or raise rents on my tenants.

[–] [email protected] 66 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I know this is sarcastic but I can’t help read it in my literal bosses voice, who didn’t give us Christmas bonuses but did fix the sail on his yacht immediately after a storm for like £20k or some bs

[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Yeah even knowing full well it was sarcasm couldn't help but hear it in the voice of my boss, who is so delusional they constantly talk about rolling back my department, the only one that actually makes money, cause our wages are too expensive (spoilers, they aren't, 1/10th of our staff is on food stamps but our boss can afford a new luxury car.)

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago

You've already sacrificed so much, we can't possibly ask you to sacrifice anymore. God, we've been so selfish talking about barely being able to afford rent or food to eat, when really we should've been thinking about how you felt about the whole thing. I'm so sorry we've inconvenienced you in any way. You know, go ahead and skip paying me for a bit and take that submarine trip on OceanGate you've always wanted to do, everyone has been talking so much about it lately.

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This goes against what Republicans want. They're literally removing child labor laws so kids can get into the work force while they're in middle school. Start a kid working at 12 years old and they can get about 50 years of labor out of them. Chances are that kid will be working 60-70 years and won't be able to retire.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I got a job at 16 and worked part time through college and have been full time since. 1/3 of my adult life (6 years) was doing 60 hour weeks. I'm by no means the most responsible with my finances but I don't buy tons of frivolous stuff. Haven't been on a real vacation since 2014. Haven't taken off unless I've gotten sick (I caught COVID 3 times).

I don't expect to be able to retire. I expect to starve to death when I can no longer work.

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[–] [email protected] 41 points 1 year ago

For like 10 years my work didn't want to pay as many pharmacist hours so offered 30 hour full time roles for the slower stores. I rode that wave as long as I could. It's a really stressful job, but at 30 hours it felt like I had a rough job. At 40+ hours it feels like I have a rough life. I'm fully in support of this 32 hour workweek. Those extra few hours won back can be magical for physical health, mental health, hobbies. I even got an extra degree in computer science.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (11 children)

I tell people time and time again that work starts at 9 and end at 3pm, everything after is shuffling paper and killing time.

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 year ago (1 children)

But what about the poor billionaires?

"I've got one hobby space program yes, but what about second hobby space program?"

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Unfortunately, thanks to Democrats and Republicans, the four-day work week is an impossibility in the USA.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Democrats and Republicans

read: Corporations

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'm hoping the push for a 32 hour week gains enough traction that we could actually feasibly negotiate a 9-day sprint (2 week period) as the "middle ground", at least until the next wave of negotiations pushes further.

Gimme every other monday off, that way I'm always working toward either a long weekend or an early weekend

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago

This would DOUBLE my effective free time. It would improve my life so much.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (44 children)

Do you all have the Congress app installed on your phone?

Can you name your House of Representative member?

Can you name your Senators?

This will go nowhere the same way that smart gun control went nowhere, despite the vast majority of the citizenship wanting it, despite even after a room full of elementary school kids were killed. Lobbying stops what the vast majority of the citizenry want.

The only way to affect change is to lobby Congress, that's what the corporations do. Corporations lobby Congress, so you have to as well.

You need to get involved, you have to let your Representative and your Senators know that you want a four-day work week. You should even throw some donation money their way for their next election cycle.

Just commenting about it on an Internet forum isn't enough. Just waiting for somebody else to do the work isn't enough.

You are the citizen.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Dude should have run on this vs the the 15 dollar minimum wage.

This would have garnered him more support. I would have door knocked for the old bastard.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (4 children)
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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Would this include a 25% increase to hourly minimums? Because otherwise it only benefits salaried employees.

And what about workers who are paid by productivity and not time? Salespersons on commission, servers receiving tips, ride-share drivers?

I'm all for a 32-hour work-week; that's what I have myself. But let's not pretend this would be enough, or that the main beneficiaries are he working class.

[–] [email protected] 49 points 1 year ago

"No loss in pay" as far as I can interpret it would mean getting paid the same for working 32 hours as you would have for working 40, yes

The autoworkers union the article refers to as an example is seeking a 46% pay rise to coincide with the transition to 32 hours.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

While I like this idea, this is not the argument union leadership should be making to achieve this goal:

Our union's membership is clearly fed up with living paycheck-to-paycheck while the corporate elite and billionaire class continue to make out like bandits," said Fain in a statement last week. "The Big Three have been breaking the bank while we have been breaking our backs

A change in hours does nothing to address pay discrepancies and you need to pick one lane and fight for it and get it, then attack the other direction.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (15 children)

I would absolutely love to only work 32 hours a week instead of 40, 45 or 50.

I would also love four weeks vacation a year, full healthcare coverage and a unicorn in my backyard please.

[–] [email protected] 55 points 1 year ago (7 children)

Except for the unicorn, your last paragraph is my reality. Oh and it's five weeks vacation, actually. My wife even has six. Sick days not included. Those are all part of the universal health care we have.

38h work week btw. Rarely overtime.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I have 35 days on my current job but it's the first time. Normally it's been 30. I'm in Sweden.

And we don't work no 40 hours here. People come in around 9 and leave around 16 with an hour lunch break and a lot of talking and slacking during the day. This is in IT and it's been like that on every IT job I've ever had.

Nobody can or want to focus for 8 hours per day their entire lives, that's madness. We are humans. I usually focus for maybe 4 hours to get something done but I don't push myself to work more then necessary. My salary doesn't go up with more work produced.

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Apart from the mystical horse, those aren't fantastical things. France has a 35 hour work week, many countries have 4 weeks vacation as the norm, and most rich countries have full healthcare coverage. These are policy choices, not impossible dream worlds.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (6 children)

In France I work 32 hours, have 7 weeks holiday and awesome healthcare.

I have cows in place of a unicorn though.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The unicorn comment makes me think you're being a sarcastic ass.

The rest of your comment is 100% doable. At least, lots of other countries are doing it.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago

I don’t know why you throw the unicorn in there as if the rest of your comment is some crazy idea. Most of Europe functions extremely well under the work conditions you described, why is America somehow incapable of having the quality of life our European cousins have?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Oh please. Would that ever work, besides the dozens of countries and corporations that have managed without issues?

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago

Man saying two sentences about something is a pretty low bar to "champion" it.

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