you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 44 points 14 hours ago (34 children)

Started out with a good cause, but it was quickly turned to shit by selfish, evil people. Not the first time it's happened in France, I'm afraid.

  • source
  • hideshow 34 child comments
  • [–] 57 points 13 hours ago* (13 children)

    It's a classic problem with mass civil disobedience. All the elites have to do is simply wait for a selfish minority who'll choose to use the opportunity to enrich themselves at the expense of their fellows. Then they can frame the entire movement as violent and base.

    Im not advocating against civil disobedience, but you need solidarity to avoid this.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 13 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 10 hours ago* (1 child)

    Bad people distort narratives regardless of the actions of others.... No matter what she did, my first wife was always the victim. DARVO is a thing, identify it and ignore it. These people looting a market for resources after a long night of rioting does not disqualify their complaints. Their complaints must be evaluated and addressed independently of their reaction to the original violation against them.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 9 hours ago

    Their complaints must be evaluated and addressed independently of their reaction

    I 100% agree.

    These people looting a market for resources after a long night of rioting

    But this doesn't mean that revolutionary action demands we hold the delusional belief that this market was looted because the protestors were on the brink of starvation or had no access to clean water or medical supplies.

    They smashed that shop to bits because it was fun and an opportunity to rob some vapes.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 8 points 13 hours ago* (7 children)

    Greed. Its in all of us, and the filthy rich love exploiting the them, as they easier to manipulate.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 11 hours ago (6 children)

    Greed. Its in all of us

    This is something the greedy want you to believe, and an insult to the majority of humanity who would never act like this.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 9 hours ago (3 children)

    Every human is a human. We are a product of our (largely shared) genetics and circumstance.

    Every last human is capable of the evils any given human comitted. We are all the same.

    People get very defensive about this, but the only counter I ever hear is "nuh uh."

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 9 hours ago (2 children)

    Every last human is capable of the evils any given human comitted

    If you strip away everything that has made them an individual, yes you're right. But I think that just highlights that your argument is a pointless distinction.

    If you swapped me out at birth with a Nazi general, there's a good chance I'd be driven down the same life path.

    Likewise this means you have to accept that there are many people, due to their upbringing and the principles they've adopted in life, that wouldn't destroy a corner shop for no reason. That wouldn't assault a woman trying to protect her place of work.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 0 points 9 hours ago* (1 child)

    First of all that was just a "nuh uh." But,

    Likewise this means you have to accept that there are many people, due to their upbringing and the principles they've adopted in life, that wouldn't destroy a corner shop for no reason.

    No human chose how to be brought into the world. Your argument is not substantive.

    Empathy is the path forward. Othering outgroups is not. We have plenty of research to back this up.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 8 hours ago*

    Your argument is not substantive.

    Well if your rebuttal is simply determinism then I think you'll find that nobody's arguments can possibly contain any substance.

    Empathy is the path forward.

    Agreed.

    Othering outgroups is not

    Nobody has been othered. In fact using it in this way dilutes the word as its simply rhetoric intended to censor discussion behind a purity test.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -1 points 9 hours ago (1 child)

    Doesn't change that it's in all of us even if you don't personally act on it.

    We all have it in our capacity to do great good or great evil in the world.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 9 hours ago (1 child)

    All the elites have to do is simply wait for a selfish minority who'll choose to use the opportunity to enrich themselves at the expense of their fellows.

    Which is EXACTLY what the Elites do as matter of routine. They just don't like it when it gets turned on THEM.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 9 hours ago

    So I'm sure you'll agree it's much better to loot an apple store or burn down a billionaires mansion rather than smash a corner shop to bits and assault other working class people.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 17 points 12 hours ago

    It's still a good cause. Just because a few hundred assholes take advantage of the situation doesn't mean the hundred of thousands that went to the street to protest peacefully are wrong

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 13 points 12 hours ago (1 child)

    FYI the topic of protest was "life is too expensive." So there's really no mystery as to why people are stealing.

    More generally, looting is to be expected in a society that constantly tells us the meaning of life and our our moral worth is based on what we own, all the while denying most people any chance to actually own anything. Looting is one of the monstrous avatars of capitalism.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 5 points 9 hours ago

    Trickle Down Economics created all these Sociopathic Oligarchs, and it has been obvious for decades that the benefits of Trickle Down Economics were fraudulent from the beginning. They refuse to surrender Trickle Down, so now society is spontaneously pivoting to Robin Hood Economics, and it's going to spread.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 6 points 12 hours ago

    It happens in every worthwhile protest. If you see it more it's partly because the media wants you to, partly because things are so bad your country has been letting more people feel this is okay.

    Also, everyone thinks the French revolution was so cool, but beheadings weren't normal back then either, it probably wasn't the most well-spoken of the protestors doing that violence either.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 5 points 13 hours ago (12 children)

    How do you know they're selfish, evil people?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 12 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 13 hours ago (2 children)
  • [–] 4 points 9 hours ago (1 child)

    I mean I see people stealing stuff, but there are a lot of valid reasons for stealing. I'm just wondering how they know the motivation behind the stealing.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 0 points 6 hours ago

    if they are taking a bottle of water and a sandwich because they are exhausted, that's fine. If they are taking expensive electronics and brand clothes, they are low-life scum deliberately allowed to behave like this by the oppressive class, to taint the protests. It's hard to see which is happening on this video, but I am assuming the latter.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 13 hours ago (3 children)
  • [–] 5 points 9 hours ago*

    Yes, but that doesn't by default make someone evil or selfish. There are stories like Robin Hood, an obvious thief, in which stealing is considered completely fine, admirable even. I'm not saying that's the case here, I'm just wondering how the original commenter knows the motivation behind people's stealing here.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -3 points 11 hours ago (4 children)

    I don't know, could it be that they're running around in their Nike sneakers while breaking and entering, coming back out with beer and kinder surprise? They're not exactly lamenting "we have no bread"...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 hours ago (3 children)

    Even if they were taking only bread, what do the brand of sneakers matter? What are you suggesting? An ethical looter would fashion their own footwear out of burlap and string or something instead of wearing whatever footwear they have handy?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] -2 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

    If you can afford Nike, you can afford a loaf of bread. I've met people in developing countries who are wearing sandals worn paper thin and are pushing most of what they own around on a cart. They get only one meal a day, and still refuse to steal - instead, they do whatever they can to make an honest living, however modest it may be. Those are the ones who deserve sympathy and respect, not the hooligans barging their way into shops to help themselves.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] -1 points 10 hours ago* (2 children)

    During riots, people often loot markets for food and water. Which makes perfect sense: they aren't carrying a lot of resources and a night of high adrenaline rioting will exhaust and dehydrate people.

    The only real solution is to provide access to cheap or free food and water throughout and after, but who is going to do that?

    The stores themselves could lock up the pricey stuff and offer water access and cheapo food stuff, ask for payment, but not lock their doors or make a huff if people don't pay. But they'd have to plan for it, and not every business is going to be riot savey.

    Besides, most biz are covered by insurance, so not really a big deal.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments