647
‘There were no warning signs’: what happens when your partner falls into the ‘manosphere’?
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 20 Apr 2025
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Just based on what I see women doing around me all the time, there were probably some warning signs. Looking for a dude that's "traditional" or whatever is asking for a dude that's going to see you like a form of livestock. It's partly a politics thing, but largely an assholes thing.
WTF those are both shockingly high.
If you just translate the figures to "41% of young men, 12% of young women are stupid assholes", they make a bit more sense.
There are many different ways to be a stupid asshole, and you can even do it while at the exact opposite end of the political spectrum.
Confirmed. Sometimes I start a sentence and don't even know what my point is until I get to the end of it! I am a total fool. But at least I'm not a fuckin chud.
Yup. In the last week or two, I managed to snort shampoo. I wasn't trying to get high; I'm just operating at that level of organisation.
I'm not personally a left-wing asshole, although that's more of a show thing than a tell thing. But, I've gotten to know plenty. The point being that thinking Andrew Tate is cool is a very specific kind of dumb and/or mean.
Still, 41% sounds absolutely critical level, like we need to stop all society and have a conversation, because that is so uncool.
Fucking 41... Like that is a plurality. That is a whole fucking lot of wrong people. That is entirely too many bros. I'm not sure I can impart just how disappointing that number is.
It is disheartening but still tracks with how I've seen older boys / younger men for decades.
Yeah....
I mean, it's a tale as old as time.
Shitty males buy females thing to avoid being held accountable.
I support Tate...
...Being locked in prison for the rest of his life.
But first I would really like him to receive a serious public ass-beating, recorded for posterity. I feel like that would be worse for him than the prison time.
There isn't anything wrong with a traditional worldview but it certainly doesn't fit most modern relationships. Either way I think all young men go through an idiot phase where it's easier to complain about the systems in place then to be introspective and improve yourself. I'm saying most people usually go through a redpill phase and if they are able to sympathize then it's usually a short phase. The bigger worry for me is that it seems a larger and larger amount of men are unable to sympathize with others.
Depends what you mean by "traditional worldview". I'll go ahead and say young earth creationism shows a lack of openness to objective reality when it's not personally convenient.
In the context I mean, what gets justified with tradition is behavior like putting on a fake persona when dating, pushing boundaries, disregarding the rights of strangers around them and generally being an entitled, eventually controlling dickwad. They'll say that's what men have always done, and boys will be boys or whatever, but I'm certain nobody had to "twist their arm".
When I see one of those dudes dragging a girl around, I have to wonder if she's chasing a kink. That's not how you go about it, if so. 50 Shades of Grey was fiction.
I want to say that's a young person thing but I'm not really sure. I know the world would be a much better place if say Alan Watts was a household name instead of Andrew Tate.
I had to look it up, but it sounds like he was a new age/counterculture personality. I don't really see the connection.
Not unable, unwilling. It requires them to be 'weak' and concede that they may be part of the problem. I say this as a man that had to work through some of this shit when I was young.
I agree on the "weak" part, being able to empathize with orders requires that you be able to admit your own faults, but I think empathy is actually a high-intellect ability. It's deeper than being just uninformed.
So, we should only listen to one party's complaints?
No one said that.
Right, it was implied though.
Essentially, we shouldn't listen to the men complaining but the men should listen to you complaining?
No. We're saying you should look inward and address your own short-comings and poor behaviors before looking to blame external sources for your issues. No one is saying anything about what men should listen to.
No one implied that.
I disagree.
Usually it's the 'modern' women who have been convinced to be treated like livestock. Nothing very traditional about going to raves or wearing pasties.
There's green-tea smelling book clubs too if that's more their speed, but a lot of people think raves are fun. Same for the pasties; they're an option, but it sounds like hipsters in a version of full Victorian dress are just as much of a thing. The central fact being that they get a choice.
The various cultures around the world have many, often contradicting versions of traditionalism. My own tells a good story about women having "respect", but it's a version of respect that doesn't require much from men.
Listen to a random country song. There's a party with cheap beer, where the women are just potential bedpost notches, but the protagonist goes to church on Sunday and feigns piousness, so they still get to be One of the Holy Ones™. A girl's dad shows up and defends her "honour", but it's implied he did the exact same shit when he was young, and at no point are her preferences considered at all. The song ends with a thinly veiled plug for the pickup truck company sponsoring the artist.
It's easy to see why dudes who hew to that are just looking for a way to justify how shitty they always were, underneath it all. Because in practice I see that all the time, living where I do.