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Dems Reportedly Angry That Progressives Are Pushing Them to Act Like an Opposition Party.
(www.commondreams.org)
this post was submitted on 12 Feb 2025
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I voted 3rd party in the election in a swing state and would do it again today.
The Democrats need to internalize the political cost of supporting Israel. If they want to win, they have to drop Israel.
I don’t think that is a lesson to take away here
A party with more support for Israel won so if that was the issue then it seems they didn’t support Israel enough
Can always count on democrats to interpret any sensory input as confirmation that they aren't far enough to the right.
The takeaway of a better person would be that that wasn’t the deciding issue
Seeing as centrists dems cant win without the left I dont think your point matters. The left isnt about to make any deals that include genocide, period. Not hard genocide, not diet-genocide. Harris could have won by breaking from Biden and calling Bidens actions genocide, but she refused to and she lost the voters. And if the next dem does the same they will lose the same. Its really that simple. And yes, the people that left their ballot blank or voted third party will do the exact same thing again, even as Trump burns the country down.
If we have to burn a country to the ground with murderous war crime enabling policies, our system does not deserve to exist either.
America’s far left are centrists
Your point of burning the system to the ground i can get behind but your proposal of doing that by letting fascists decide how to rebuild it instead of using violence (if you’re a terrorist) or public protests (if you’re a pacifist) is not something I would suggest
I'm not exactly in favor of burning it down either if I am allowed that choice, but my actions are limited to: vote Dem, vote republicans, not vote, or vote third party. And I dont see how I get to no genocide plus please dont burn my world down from those choices.
By taking a tougher line on Israel than Biden? Possibly yes.
No, that could have completely sunk her campaign. Because "genocide" is hyperbole. Just because people here rarely bother to point out that "genocide" is obvious hyperbole, does not mean that the vast majority of voters do not know that using the word "genocide" is obvious hyperbole.
(1) Biden didn't have any "actions" in Gaza. That was Hamas and Israel
(2) War crimes are not the same thing as "genocide". Genocide means trying to exterminate an entire population.
(3) A war is not the same as war crimes. There has to be intentional killings of civilians.
The Palestinian Genocide is a genocide.
This is not up for debate.
Hyperbole is hyperbole. It is precisely because 99% of people know that it is hyperbole, and they know that 99% of people know it is hyperbole, that nobody bothers to point out the obvious to you.
Genocide denier.
Yep. I always avoid bullshit. If it wasn't bullshit you would have tried to refute my 3 points. But we both know you can't. Did you really think that 99% of people didn't know this was hyperbole just because nobody thought this hypobole was important enough to issue a reality check before?
Genocide denier.
Dumb idiot.
Are you happy with the current administration's Israel policy though?
The voted third party so I imagine not.
Except unless they had been lobotomized, they knew damn well that their vote was being thrown away and that Trump would be the likely winner.
Which is tact approval of Trump and everything that came with it.
You're rephrasing the post as though you're making a "gotcha!" statement, when it's just the thing they said. Their argument is that the Dems needed to lose for any chance of party reform to occur, and they voted in a way that would encourage that outcome.
It's an argument that I find compelling, especially given the fact that the Democrat leadership seems to be actively trying to learn all the wrong lessons from their humiliation, where they are trying to learn anything at all. This indicates to me that, to some degree, OP is correct and there wasn't even a snowball's chance in hell that party leadership would have done anything significant had they coasted to victory based solely on being not-Nazis.
To seat his logic in another context, where the Trump of it all is not a factor, it's the same argument I've heard lefties trot out in a discussion about legal vs illegal protest tactics. Which is to say, effective protest is protest which forces people to engage with the issue being discussed, and legal protest is ineffective because, by design, it is easily ignored by both the public and the powers that be.
All that being said, the argument is not so compelling as to convince me that any pain caused to the Dems in service of organizing an actual progressive wing is worth the pain Trump's election is causing people, the environment, or the world in general. I don't know anything about OP, so I don't want to state this as fact, but, to me, it smacks of the privilege that comes with figuring they will make it through this period okay (if not particularly great). Therefore, it's worth it to them to endure this inconvenience, in the hopes that it effects change in the Dems. Attack their argument on that front all you like, but you're not contributing anything by saying "you helped elect Trump!" when that's what they said they did and they'd do it again.
Are we pretending the dems werent the ones who leveled gaza and committed genocide so far? They did that shit and they promised to do more of it.
And we dont know who to credit with the ceasefire.
Am I wrong? seems like those are just facts.
No, we're not pretending that at all. Is the current administrations policy better?
I dont think thats a forward looking question. Lets try: "Was that a good policy choice and does that represent who Dems say we are going forward?" and "should we trust centrists in leadership any longer because they sure have been out of touch screwing the pooch for a long time" and "do we want more of this right-wing-lite fascist war support BS?"
I'm tired of losing through DNC immorality and incompetence. Arent you? Its way past time to clean house.
I'd prefer you answer my question. Are you happy with the current administration's policy?
Sticking to the canned messaging only eh. I sure do understand why you'd take that approach.
You don't seem to understand anything. It's a yes or no question.
Is the current administration's Israel policy preferable to you?
You're not answering because only a psychopath would say yes. But saying no, if you voted 3rd party, is admitting you fucked up. That's why you avoid it. You can't admit you're wrong.
Just like the vote was a Trump or Harris vote, period? How'd that work out for us champ? Its almost like Harris should have taken a broader view of the concrete issues at hand than just asking the voters to ask themselves "if she was better than trump", and vote accordingly. Do you notice how that strategy is now being panned as out of touch, full of hubris, and pretty stupid?
The world is not limited to carefully scripted yes or no's to the only thing phrased in the only terms you want to talk about. Controlled narrow framings like yours are exactly how we lost, so thank you for your service, finitebanjo.
Still dancing. You're stiiilllll dancing.
All you have is a single note and no one can dance to that.
But yeah I'm dancing over here. I can dance if I want to. I can leave my friends behind.
So no one came dance to what I'm saying but you can? Even your metaphors lack cohesion. Guess it's hard to come up with something coherent when you don't live in the real world.
Is that a sex thing? yeah no thanks bro.
Man, dont I wish. We live in exactly the same world. Theres only one and thats why its worth taking a stand on issues and not being a centrist noodle about everything while leopards eat half your face.
You know how I know you're an unserious person that I can ignore now? When you're on the ropes you jump on an obvious typo. So long loser.