I think it's more along the lines of the "it's a bold strategy, Cotton, let's see if it pays off for 'em" sentiment

aha, this comment makes your position a bit more clear for me. reading your initial response had me feeling a bit kerfuffled because, for me and for the progressive people I know, the line is pretty clear as to what's acceptable and what's not- it comes down to whether someone is making an attempt to dehumanize others or defend those actions in others. there's SO much effort being made to paint the position of "the left" as anything and everything else, but it really does boil down to standing for the humanity and dignity of others. when our poorest, weakest, most vulnerable members of society can thrive, we all thrive. it's important to recognize beliefs that are trying to masquerade as that when they're really something else altogether.

in other words, I think it's important to really get at what a belief is about. I wouldn't call that automatic pushback against men's rights and supporting men progressive or left wing, tbh. you're so right that there is a ton of automatic pushback on the part of a lot of people because they assume men's rights = the typical MRA misogyny. misandry is woven into so much of that response and people don't necessarily consider how they're hurting others in an extremely similar way when they embrace that narrative. the conversation around how to support men does get so toxic so quickly for a few reasons, yet it's not the zero-sum game many people treat it as. the reality is, men can be subject to things like domestic violence and rape too, and they deserve support just like anyone else in those situations. at a fundamental level, supporting men in these situations isn't the threat to women and others that a ton of people treat it as in their knee-jerk reaction to the topic. these hard topics deserve discussion and consideration too, but often the reactions we're talking about, that pushback, doesn't come from a place of offering respect and dignity. and that's not very "left wing", so to speak.

I think because I'm queer, pan specifically, there's a sort of odd sort of advantage in this regard in being exposed to situations where calling out regressive beliefs that masquerade as progressive happens a bit more frequently. there are pleeeenty of examples of this in queer spaces- misogyny from gay men, misandry from gay and bi women (honestly, in my experience the latter has been MORE problematic in that regard, but I'm keenly aware that's my own experience and maybe not that of others), TERF & LBG-but-not-the-T groups, and bi erasure are all queer examples of this that are encountered, sadly, not infrequently. Pride is meant to be a radical celebration of people living their life to the fullest as their true self, and it's so often not, instead bogged down by division, othering, and sometimes downright hatred. There are unfortunately a lot of people out there who treat their own queerness as a zero-sum game where breaking the mould and being different is seen as a threat to their own existence because that's just how their belief system works. People don't necessarily want to think of themselves as regressive in their beliefs, but when they're pushing a narrative of misinformation or hate, it's so, so important to recognize and call out that bullshit for exactly what it is- it's not left-wing, it's not progressive, it's a defense of a status quo that harms others.

Outside of queer spaces, you might not get as much exposure to digging at problematic viewpoints like that, to the pushback that happens to that reaction you're talking about. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking "both sides" when you have these anecdotes of harm, but when you really dig into the beliefs, it's really not both sides, at all. It's important to call out regressive beliefs for what they are, it's important to identify a hateful belief as such, and it takes so much courage to do that when those voices are screaming at you and over you from different directions. I hope you know, this queer gal sees you and what you're advocating for when it comes to supporting men who face harm, and supports you in that.

Canadians by and large have been spending more than they earn for decades now. Check out the average debt-to-income ratio from even 20 years ago, I remember economists being worried and that making the news even back then. Real estate is what props up our GDP to provide the illusion that we're a rich country, and no politician except maybe Singh will ever actually work to change that so home ownership becomes less burdensome and more accessible to everyday people, because it will have an impact on the GDP.

Wait, you guys are gonna be able to retire? /s

It's been pretty obvious to me most of my adult life that people like myself will always only ever struggle to make ends meet and will never have the luxury of not working (I'm mid 30s now). Honestly, that's the only rather perverse upside to our current state of greedflation, that sense of "hey, it's not just me anymore, it's everyone". Plenty of people out there feel like people in poverty deserve it somehow, and aren't shy in expressing that, so watching them struggle to be poor has been... an experience of awful validation, I guess is how I would describe it. But to the point, the work I do now I'll be able to do when I'm elderly and/or ill too, it's not physically taxing at all, so that's my old age plan lol.

lol you do realize they'll have fines to pay at the very least, right? This isn't black market dealing, this is a push for decriminalization knowing full well that civil disobedience has some expensive and unavoidable consequences.

I was referring to your obvious bigotry towards trans and queer people, but clearly there are all sorts of problems with christofascist views, thanks for highlighting that for me ;) lol at your mentions of "ideology" while simultaneously repeating old canned talking points from alt right propaganda.

No one owes you a platform. In fact, christofascists and those who break the treaty of tolerance very much deserve to be deplatformed. Your views aren't based on reality or evidence, and only serve to dehumanize.

And FYI, since you brought it up, abortion is a medical procedure that is between a patient and their doctor. A retired "Christian" Navy vet who supports Desantis is the absolute LAST person whose opinions should be respected on that subject.

Yeah, one look at your banner, and it's very clear that you're willfully obtuse in this regard. Someone else's humanity, and right to live freely and peacefully without harassment, isn't up for debate. The line is pretty easy to identify- "am I dehumanizing someone?", and if you struggle with that, this isn't the space for you. If you embrace christofascism, expect pushback.

Red pill/blue pill was written as an analogy to the experience of trans people, as well. The ignorance with how they've co-opted the concept runs quite deep.

Was the post language specified? That can cause these issues I believe, I don't think it's for NSWF filters

Oh just stop with this nonsense. Your statement about "convoluting factors" demonstrates your complete and total ignorance of the strength and weight and sheer amount of evidence behind mRNA technology available at this point. Antivaxx talking points rely on these fundamental misunderstandings and ignorance, lmfao at your attempt to condescend to lay people in this way when you clearly don't even know how RCTs are run or fundamentally work. There are actually decades of research behind this stuff at this point, this misinformation is tired and old. And so easily disproven by listening to people who understand the science, who work with the science, who have engaged with the evidence. And to pre-emptively rebuttal against the appeal to authority you might be chomping at the bit to make- being a pioneer a few decades ago in the field means nothing if you haven't kept abreast to new discoveries, innovations, and evidence. I can just see you being "part of the community" as a lab manager or something, a pencil pusher at best, nothing more and certainly not someone with the training to understand the statements you're making.

The fun part of this whole issue is that since SCOTUS has recently established people can bring forward made-up cases based on "what ifs" for violating fundamental rights and causing harm, someone in the US could plausibly sue people like you for the potential harm you may cause, because we're talking not just about a mountain of biological and medical research, but an overwhelming amount of epidemiological data as well. Literal population-level bodies of evidence concerning how much harms views like yours have caused. Fun, eh?

Medical doctors who didn't follow the evidence deserved to be spoken over and shut down by their peers. If you fail in your fundamental understanding of what your job is, the basic science behind medicine, you shouldn't be practicing anymore.

And if we're talking about comparisons to things like lobotomy, again, and I'll say it slow for you so you can follow closely- The. Strength. Of. The. Evidence. Matters. When the evidence that lobotomy is incredibly harmful and not treating the issues it was purported to treat in any way became overwhelming, guess what? The standards changed. When the evidence is overwhelming yet you still cling to conspiracies, you deserve to be shut down, no one owes you a platform for your deceit and lies and misinformation.

Done! https://lemmy.ca/c/cancon

It's the bigotry and hate that needs to be the focus of any action, not the act of protesting. I disagree that it would be detrimental for kids to see people exercising their freedom of expression, as thorny as the issue is, ultimately if you're getting kids thinking critically about the world around them and their part in it, that's a very good thing. But these bigots are literally protesting the existence of queer kids, they are protesting to be hateful and nothing more. That shit is not okay.