A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.
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I am genuinely baffled at how people are still debating this and still being so utterly wrong about it.
The reason your boss wants you in the office has been on the front page of the page for the past week.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/office-vacancy-rate-hits-record-high/ar-AA1mEGiy
A lot of money is being spent propagandizing this point, and guess which side is doing it?
There's a lot of value tied up in commercial real estate and some of the largest real estate firms will get soaked if those offices aren't occupied and paid for.
The thing is, capitalism almost always makes the wrong short term decisions to result in long term results, so instead of adapting to the problem we are at the stage that the value holders will burn themselves quite a lot to cling to forcing everyone back to the office.
And a LOT of people are susceptible to propaganda.
Its all about the property income. They need people to fill the offices regardless of productivity. Even if you are not more productive, you are still lining someone else's pockets.
This is absolutely the real reason... Everyone who knows shit knows it's bullshit, but they want their commercial rent back.
I’m sure this is true for some businesses, but there are also tons of businesses that have no vested interest in commercial real estate. It doesn’t explain all of it.
Honestly I think a much better explanation is that on average, bosses like being in the office and they don’t understand why everyone isn’t like them. Top leadership tends to be extroverted and they got where they are by lots of networking. They don’t have enough appreciation that for a lot of other types of people and types of jobs, being in the office just makes things harder.
It's not a singular issue. You both have valid points.
It's also about local economies losing the market share they had pre 2020. Every business in between your house and your job loses revenue. And all of that encompasses local tax revenue.
In other words it's completely changed the commuting economy in it's entirety. From the top down and those who have vested interests want that back.
Those are actual logical reasons. I personally think it's more emotional.
For most of the last 100 years the corner office with a view and all sorts of luxuries has been a "reward" for middle to upper management.
Now nobody gives a shit about those offices. It hurts their feelers that nobody gives a shit about their perks anymore.
Absolutely, it's a huge cultural shift. And it happened quick too, which humans aren't really good at reacting to.
I think every reason you can imagine plays a role in it. But yeah the cultural norms are a huge part of it, we've been conditioned to view those things as success.
This. What’s the point of finally getting that corner office if there’s no one to feel superior over?
You also have items in the article noting that managers who saw drops in performance during the pandemic were the ones most likely to pull people into the office. So it seems like some managers saw issues with group performance and going back to the office was seen as a way to resolve the issue.
Why though? Utilities would be cheaper if the property was vacant then you can just end the lease!
I think these managers who love open office don't understand we need individual rooms.
Also, before talking about returning, there are bigger factors that contribute to productivity. Having a secretary is probably far more important than working in an office.
And to completely de-motivate to return, I work for my life, not the other way around.
I think these managers who love open office don't understand we need individual rooms.
It's hard to understand while sitting in a corner office
I think it’s more that it’s hard to understand when you’re extroverted and your job depends on talking to people all day.
Yeah I’d kill for an office at this point. Like it’s not even to fuck around, I just need to not be constantly distracted or on show. I’m a professional, part of my job is sitting there thinking, I’d like to have space to do that. But nope, open office plan with insane upper management
Wasn't this always just a way to do stealth layoffs?
For some companies, yes. Ultimately, it all extends from greed. Gotta keep my using my land because otherwise it will lose value. Gotta layoff people to make profits go up. Must make money printer go, Brrrrr.
It's ironic because only the largest of companies actually own the land their offices are on. Most companies are seeing higher costs as a result of holding onto offices that they don't actually need.
RTO is in effect making employees significantly less productive because their productivity is countered by the added expense of leasing and maintaining offices.
Data only matters to them if they can use it to support the conclusions they want. Otherwise they just ignore at best or at worst call it fake news.
I had a ceo who was all about data driven decisions. It was a core company value. They put it on tshirts.
Workers pointed out that studies were showing 4 day work weeks were good on most metrics. He didn't give a single shit. Just laughed and said we're not doing that.
Exactly. They'll claim "it's just business" when they need to lay off half their workers and squeeze anyone left twice as hard but when it's something upsetting to them, all the studies in the world won't convince them to loosen their leashes.
What is that article picture? A bunch of 4:3 monitors, people sitting on unpadded wooden chairs, shoulder to shoulder? What kind of office hellpit is that?
Open seating facilitating C o l l a b o r a t i o n, my friend. It's the newest in a long line of corporate circle-jerk KPIs.
Quarterly losses got the shareholders on your back?
Mandate more collaborations!
Employees realizing their worth got the shareholders on your back?
Mandate more collaborations!
Feeling insecure about your authority got the shareholders on your back?
Mandate more collaborations!
The high mount of time spent collaborating on Teams/Slack got the shareholders on your back?
Mandate more collaborations!
Some other company's Exec bragging about their greater number of collaborations got the shareholders on your back?
Mandate more collaborations!
What's the easiest most effortless method to generate more collaborations without having to use any brain power whatsoever?
Copy what other CEOs who've failed have done and change nothing because you're a lazy hack but tell yourself it'll work perfectly because you're a snowflake and smarter than everyone else! 🌹🌹Return to Office! 🌹🌹
When it doesn't work, what do you do?
Blame the workers for not collaborating right! YAAAAAAAAAY!!!
Open seating facilitates headphone sales!
It’s a picture of an open office floor from 15 years ago based on the monitors, clothing, and magazine
Sheesh, I sat in an open plan office in 2008, and we had ergonomic chairs and wide desks and widescreen monitors even then. IT privilege, I suppose.
After examining the magazine being passed and discovering a (frankly super creepy) website documenting, among other things, every magazine cover featuring Angelina Jolie, that is most likely a November 2008 variety office hellpit.
And now I wonder if covid misinformation campaigns were co-paid by the same Forbes companies intentionally, to make people ignore safety measures.
It's annoying that I've seen essentially the opposite headline from Business Insider as well in the past few days. I feel like they're not much of a "news" source with this kind of clickbait content.
I change company every yeat and Often notice that the places I have worked where boss are really controlling they always seems to have a miserable life. Meaning no friends, they stay back after 5 in the name of "work" and don't care about anything but them.