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[-] chesmotorcycle@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 1 week ago

Still underestimating China at their own peril:

Analysts were not expecting China to produce a model as powerful as Fable until early next year.

[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 1 week ago

They just keep getting high on their own supply. While American companies are betting on the idea that if one model can pull away it's going to keep self improving and nobody will catch up, Chinese companies are betting there will be a plateau to this tech, and it's more important to focus on market dominance because they will catch up later.

And it's becoming clear that Chinese companies made the right bet because Chinese models are closing the gap now, which means we are getting to the point of diminishing returns already where it takes ever more effort into squeezing just a bit more capability on the frontier.

[-] chesmotorcycle@lemmygrad.ml 9 points 1 week ago

Agreed. And just to add to that, it's primarily the Chinese companies doing both the basic research and the clever optimization that will continue to make meaningful progress. Hyperscaling has real, physical limits after all. Lose-lose for the Yanks.

[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 1 week ago

Yup, and also notable how China proceeded to invest in energy infrastructure before trying to scale out compute. The Americans put the cart before the horse here.

[-] chesmotorcycle@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 week ago

The Magic of the Market^TM^

[-] Orcinus@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 week ago

I don't know how true this article is but it claims Deepseek is gunning for AGI, which sounds like the opposite of a plateau. China's putting AI in charge of R&D for chrissakes, and with a lot of the post-silicon hardware seen in their labs as well as 6G we may yet see colossal jumps in capability.

[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 1 week ago

I don't think there's anything that fundamentally prevents AGI from being developed, but I strongly suspect that it's going to take more than LLMs to do that. In fact, frontier is already moving towards world models where a physics simulation becomes the basis for reasoning. Deepseek gunning for AGI is not in any way at odds with the current methods hitting a plateau. We already know that simply making models bigger doesn't scale. It's also unlikely that feeding more data into models is going to help either. The problem is with how the architecture works, and making any substantial leaps from here will require rethinking that.

And putting AI in charge of R&D is tangential to improvement of models themselves. Current capabilities are already very useful, and when you put a model in a feedback loop, it can indeed work autonomously and produce useful results. So, current crop of models will absolutely lead to a ton of breakthroughs and new types of automation that weren't possible before. China is also very well positioned to take advantage of all that being the factory of the world.

The question is what it will take to make models themselves significantly more capable though. Look at the progress that was being made like two to three years ago. Every few months we'd see some incredible breakthrough in capability. That's basically stopped in the past year, and progress has become very incremental now.

[-] bennieandthez@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

lol get rekt, they immediately have to lower prices

[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 1 week ago

Anthropic is basically fucked now. Nobody in their right mind will pay for Opus 4.8 when Kimi is a fraction of the price and performs closer to Fable. So, the whole idea of keeping Fable exclusive is now dead in the water. But I think the very fact they felt the need to do it tells us something as well. Before, they're just release every model as a regular upgrade for all users, but with Fable they wanted to only make it available on pay to play basis. To me this suggests that either it costs a fuck ton of money to run cause it's inefficient as fuck even compared to their current models, or they're starting to hit the ceiling of what they can do with the architecture and not expecting to put out anything significantly better in the near future. Either way, Kimi just pulled the rug from under them here.

[-] bennieandthez@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 week ago

the funniest thing to me is that anthropic (and all the other US ai) are already running at unprofitable rates so they can capture market share and Chinese companies keep forcing them to lower their prices

[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 1 week ago

Yeah, the whole business model is falling apart. They can't monopolize the market, they don't have a better product, and their input costs are 3x of those than companies in China. It's a complete disaster. They got high on their own supply chasing their technological singularity while Chinese companies pragmatically took the slow and steady approach without burning through insane amounts of capital.

[-] Comprehensive49@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 1 week ago

Here's Kimi's official announcement blog post with explainers of the models architecture, capabilities, and neck-and-neck benchmarks with US frontier models: https://www.kimi.com/blog/kimi-k3

And here's their awesome announcement video: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bn0atstgavo

[-] TankieReplyBot@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 1 week ago

I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:

this post was submitted on 17 Jul 2026
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