this post was submitted on 17 Oct 2024
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(I have amended the title of this post based on feedback and critique, to more acutely reflect the target of my grievance)

This could be a bad take, but, hear me out.

I was once a subscriber to r/atheism a long time ago. I was absolutely a smug ass fucking atheist. I'm not sure what it was that caused this world view I held to change, but as time marched on I've grown incredibly suspect of anyone who willingly identifies themselves as an "atheist".

I grew up going to church every week. That slowed as I got older. I remember my grandmother telling me I needed to cut my hair at church, and telling her "I have hair like Jesus, you think Jesus should cut his hair?" I learned later we stopped going to church because they started preaching about antiabortion and my mother wanted nothing to do with that.

So I was at least fairly indifferent about religion by the time I was in highschool. I remember Atheism giving me a sense of superiority that was deeply rooted in "facts and logic" despite being a severely under read dipshit in highschool. I'm sure I spent countless amounts of time debating people in comments, being a general idiot on the internet. Probably passively consumed a bunch of Hitchens work/ideas without having read any of his books.

At some point I stopped putting a lot of thought into it, and this smug sensibility was pushed into the back of my brain. Then in 2020, like a lot of people, I was swept up in this rise in socialist thinking, leading me to change my entire perspective on the world.

I think it wasn't until recently, when I was having a conversation with someone I knew and the topic of Islam came up that I realized how much I had distances myself from this smug atheist perspective. They said something about Islam being an "inherently violent religion", and my gut, instinctual reaction was to blurt out "What? What makes you think that's true?" They responded with something being in the Quran, and again, like water from a faucet the words "Listen, maybe that's true, maybe its not, but Islamic people are not a monolith." poured out of me and the conversation kind of died on the vine.

The reason I'm even thinking about this today is because, of all things, I watched the Asmongold "apology" video he published today. He attributes his shit ass takes about Palestinians being an inferior culture and thus worthy of genocide to his "hatred for religious extremism of all kinds". He goes on to say that he was or is a "r/atheist enjoyer" and a self professed "atheist". It really confirmed a lot of assumptions I have about atheism that I guess have been lingering in my skull.

Those assumptions being that Atheism is, on it's face, a religion in and of itself. It's belief is in that of non-belief. It has missionaries like most other religious belief systems, seeking to secularize communities and cultures. It believes it is the one true religion and that all other religions are false religions with false gods. It demonizes all other practitioners of these false religions indiscriminately, believing that they are either upholding their wicked systems of oppression, or are directly complicit in them. Countless books have been written about the its theology and the logic of its faith. It is a fully fledged faith, in that you have to believe in this non-belief, on faith that you will be proven correct when you die.

Not only all this but its clear to me now that Atheism is the western liberal religious belief system. Its fully compatible with western chauvinism, as it demonizes the wests enemies on the grounds of their systems of belief, which are regularly the reason for the wests interventions. Western wars are "secular" wars and as such they are atheist colonial projects as well. The idea that modernizing a backwards 3rd world country would bring about liberal democracy and with it liberal values. Atheism is liberal values.

Now this isn't to say that religious violence doesn't exist or that religious extremism is also a fable, but instead that Atheism and its ideas are a form of religious persecution, it breeds the same phobic believes that other religions develop about the ones they are attempting to conquer. The Atheist believes that through the abolition of religion, via changing hearts and minds, a entire form of violence will be removed as well. It completely denies the material realities and conditions that cause religious extremism to begin with. Because of this, it doesn't recognize that to achieve a secular world, it will only be done so through violence.

Somehow the atheist believes that religion and culture are all somehow disconnected and isolated phenomenon. That somehow you can remove religion from the equation without damaging or altering culture. That some how this secularization will happen quietly and without conflict.

When I'm asked if I'm religious I say no. if asked if I'm an atheist, I say no. The only thing I would identify as in this context is as a materialist. It matters not to me what lays beyond the vale of life, but what does matter to me is what is happening here and now. Pain and suffering exists here in this conscious reality. Happiness can be achieved here in this conscious reality. That happiness can include religious and spiritual belief.

I have no conclusions here. This is just the ramblings of an old wizard. If I'm off base here please tell me. Interested in your perspectives as always comrades.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago) (1 children)

I grew up forced to go to church by one parent while the other showed no interest in church whatsoever and stayed home to watch Friday the 13th every Sunday.

At one point I got really into church and truly believed it. Then one parent died and that really fucked my shit up and I began to realize how dumb religion really is.

In college I worked with an absolutely militant atheist. He talked about 2 topics and only 2 topics, feminism and atheism, and would rip anyone's head off that dared try to debate any of his strongly held beliefs, while also trying to convert everyone else to his way of thought.

He ripped me a new asshole one day when he asked if I was an atheist and I said no. He was incensed because he knew I didn't believe in god, or really any religious stuff at all, but I would deign to reject atheism too. Little did he know that he was the reason I wanted nothing to do with atheism. I did not want to be so against something that I spent all my time and energy fighting against something I didn't believe in in the first place. I don't care if someone else believes in whatever. I don't even care if someone is hardcore atheist. I just don't want anyone trying to tell me to label myself and act a certain way because thats what they believe and what they think I should be doing.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 hours ago

Yet you pass time with ebil tankis, curious

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago) (1 children)

Your take is a bold one, but for the most part I stand with it.

I'm nonreligious; I don't say "atheist" anymore because of the sociopolitical baggage that the word entails and the subcultural implications that it often has, ranging from cult-of-the-self libertarianism to cult-of-the-computer "Singularity" prophecies to "RETVRN to Cultural Christianity" or even "oops I found religion again, bucko" over-correction because of either out of control 40k LARPing or "oh no I'm actually scared of dying and need to find a god that validates me being a hateful piece of shit before I go to heaven" failures of integrity.

"ACKSHULLY ALL PROBLEMS IN THE WORLD ARE BECAUSE OF RELIGION" takes sometimes show up on Hexbear, and to me they're hard to tell apart from fundies that hand out Jack Chick tracts and say "do you know if everyone in the world was Christian, there would be no more war?" smuglord

I think it wasn't until recently, when I was having a conversation with someone I knew and the topic of Islam came up that I realized how much I had distances myself from this smug atheist perspective. They said something about Islam being an "inherently violent religion

Sam Harris cultists are among the worst New Atheists for exactly that. They openly speak of targeted precrime panpticons against Muslims and even "glass the Middle East" genocide power fantasies because they're fucking monsters that follow a monstrous (and fraudulent) cult leader.

https://rhizzone.net/articles/sam-harris-fraud/

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 hours ago

This is exactly what I'm railing against. I guess my perspective wasn't yet wide enough to understand how westernized my perspective on atheism had become. This thread really opened my eyes in a profound way. In s way that allows me to express my perspective on atheism with much more nuance then previously.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 hours ago

So, I still call myself an atheist if anyone asks. That being said, I will happily, all day every day, distance myself from the Dawkins/Hitchens kind of "atheism" (really, islamophobia). It sucks that most "atheists" are really just islamophobes with an acceptable coat of paint, but on the other hand, I've been an atheist my whole life, I'm not about to change how I conceptualize my lack of religious belief and what word I use to describe it just because some absolute assholes have decided to use that same word to describe their incredibly bigoted beliefs. I might be wrong to stick with the word, I really might be, but it's been part of who I am for so long that I'm just simply not going to stop using it for myself.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago)

Those assumptions being that Atheism is, on it's face, a religion in and of itself. It's belief is in that of non-belief. It has missionaries like most other religious belief systems, seeking to secularize communities and cultures. It believes it is the one true religion and that all other religions are false religions with false gods. It demonizes all other practitioners of these false religions indiscriminately, believing that they are either upholding their wicked systems of oppression, or are directly complicit in them. Countless books have been written about the its theology and the logic of its faith.

A lot of New Atheists will smugly say "ACKSHULLY I just believe in one less god than monotheists do" smuglord and claim they have an absence of beliefs the way that reactionaries and liberals claim they have an absence of political views, yet that was proven glaringly false after the over-reaction against "Atheism+" and its attempt for atheism to be about something other than smug self-superiority.

Remember when those same "no beliefs" dipshits tried to get people to call them "brights?" I sure do. jagoff

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 hours ago

Yeah, I also used to be part of that "skeptic" and "atheist" community. It's definitely not all atheists, just a big group of smug people who need a way of feeling superior

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