I've done the "try really hard to fit into normie group, get burned" a few times, except every time it's been a queer or neurodiverse group or people, who are supposed to not be normies themselves, so there's a problem on my end clearly.

I am pretty "lucky" though in that I realised I was trans at age 15 so I never really had the chance to try assimilating or whatever. My wife is beautiful but Idk if any of my past partners would have been considered normatively attractive, so it never really got me any ins with people. My first girlfriend was an insufferable military brat though, which occasionally led to me being abrasive and weird in upper middle class "polite" company, that was fun. Her parents were legit "concerned for her safety" when she wanted to wear a dress the first time, lol.

It is hard to listen to normals generally though, and not just because hearing dumb jokes about AES countries flips the "UNCRITICAL SUPPORT THE DEMOCRATIC PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF KOREA IN THEIR HEROIC STRUGGLE TO etc" switch, but also because with a lib-or-worse worldview and subsequent lack of understanding, the average normie is often not prone to deep or interesting thoughts, I think.

Also I don't know anyone else who reads freakishly weird books all day =)

My wife n I are pretty content existing outside of society socially, mostly I spend my time trying to find that non-normo niche to fit into, which hasn't panned out. Oh well, nevertheless,

I think I stopped looking to "fit in" when I realized my actual desire was to be genuinely loved by others, and to viscerally feel that was true. Being "in the group" was a poor substitute for this feeling. Many groups of people do not love each other very well, and these tend to be the groups that take a lot of energy to conform to.

If you're not marxist/anarchist, activist, vegan, and/or mask wearing, I can't honestly force myself to talk to you.

I feel pretty close to this but I'm still negotiating it for myself. I agree with what you said about "It's shorthand for giving a fuck," because that's how I see it as well. You have to give a fuck in order to love a person, and the dominant culture generates apathy towards others.

When I focus my efforts on covid-conscious people, I know at least that they believe in caring for themselves/others so strongly that they are willing to not only reject the dominant culture, but be materially harmed (harassed or assaulted in public, fired or not hired, verbally abused, shunned, denied services) because of it. This is a good start for being able to love in a friendship, even though it's not everything.

If you're not marxist/anarchist, activist, vegan, and/or mask wearing

Hate to break it to you, but that's a very niche person. It's also limiting to constrain your associates to those traits. That could be the ideal friend group, sure, but you can still make friends with someone completely opposite of you, if you are both mature and understanding of each other's beliefs.

I have a couple friends like that, we talk about our differences, but we don't try and convert the other person, or make them feel bad for liking one thing over another.

I met a vegan online, and they shared information that was new to me. I learned that, in another life, I would be vegetarian. If I had not spent time getting to know this person, or meeting the many other people I have, I would not have learned as much, and I would still be very naive.

I felt the same way about finding a stable partner as part of attaining middle class status but, when my career goals didn't pan out, neither did that. Now my relationship to it is a kind of love/hate feeling, where I still want to arrive at those signifiers but, keep having to remind myself they are unattainable social constructs imposed on me by society and I shouldn't tie myself into knots over it.

As for friend groups, they never really bother with me and I never really put up the energy to bother with them. It doesn't really bother me except at this point I realize a key to that above-mentioned middle class material success is networking. I never really developed social skills for it in school, especially given having the time for the extracurricular activities associated with middle class networking was outside our income range.

I don't know. I guess I've just learned to accept being the person people aren't interested in talking to. Though every once in a while I wish I knew people with the same niche interests as me.

I am 35 for context.

I spent my youth trying to get the local hippies to like me. There used to be a lot of action and clandestine fun in that scene. Or so it seemed. I never really got accepted, but I kept showing up anyway and had a blast despite the cliquey aspect of it all.

I recently had to take a few years off from the scene because of COVID, buying a house, getting married and shifting priorities. Well, I've been going back a bit now that things are settled and it was so eye opening to see what losers and scumbags were left.

I've always thought that stuff like that was stuff you did to fill the space before you have real meaning in your life. There are still some weekend warriors like me who like to dip their toe back in, and they seem mostly alright, but the lifers will steal your face right off your head (to borrow from Grateful Dead lyrics) and it's just sad to see all of the people who went all in and have no future.

Like I said, I had a lot of fun, but I'm ready to move on and be happy with the life I've built. A lot of hippies are trying to escape something. I focused on building a life I didnt have to escape from.

There's truth in the saying "hippies are mean people pretending to be nice, and punks and metalheads are nice people pretending to be mean"

Just my two cents

Life from school to through uni through the early naughts felt like everyone was angling to get in the in-group.

Euphoria is extremely funny to me. Everything about it is terrible, but what really makes me chuckle is how “inclusive” the portrayal of cliques seem to be. Some way, some how, every weirdo and dork manage to congregate at the same events and parties.

In a way it’s realistic because I can attest to it. I was never popular, but also not at the bottom of the “cool” hierarchy. I was like Bart Simpson in terms of my placement in the hierarchy. Kind of an odd ball, but people from both ends of the spectrum were friendly to me, although most of the people on the “nerdy outcast” side of the spectrum kept to themselves and I was never part of their clique. I had several cliques and acquaintances and the people ranged from weirdo, weirdo who pulled, nerds, popular by association, popular, gang and cartel members, drama queens, and hot people. As such not everyone clowned on me for being me, but i wasn’t exactly their first choice of interaction - I just happen to be at the right place at the right time sometimes.

Elementary was kind of funnier. We had “crews” that formed naturally between close friends, it had arbitrary, unwritten rules, and people were purged (or “fired”) and accepted back for smallest infractions. If we got spiteful enough we would splinter into a rival crew, only to disband it because the original was usually always superior in terms of cohesiveness (we were friends, whereas the splinter groups were made up of random kids who were recruited out of opportunity lol). I was the de facto leader because 1. I was the tallest and 2. Most of my friends didn’t take initiative on our activities.

I spent my 20s and 30s repeating the same cycle: meet a group of people, feel accepted, try really hard to be part of the group, then get burned from said normie group for various reasons. The older I got the harder I tried. Like guys, I GOTTA make this group work because I'm running out of time.

I’m in my 20s. About to be in my mid 20s. I’m still trying to find the right group of friends and a girlfriend while I’m college because lord knows it’ll be miserable in a work place. And I’ve wasted half a decade with nothing to show for it, and I have less a few semesters left.

*Sorry I know that "typically attractive" can be problematic and arbitrary. In this story, I'm referring to the irrational standard enforced by the mainstream culture and media.

You don’t need to put a disclaimer lol. You dated this person presumably because you’re attracted to her right? So they’re attractive. All attraction is is arbitrary.

@[email protected] If you can get into some community sports stuff at a center or anything, if you're in a decently sized city, you're bound to make some friends that way
But yeah, being the potential brother in law is the best. i haven't had anything serious for a while. i am feeling that absence of social links from having a competent S.O. but i haven't really been depressed idk. just FOMO