cross-posted from: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/7802418
Don't forget about the Irish unification of 2024!
this post was submitted on 05 Nov 2023
132 points (83.3% liked)
Risa
6899 readers
17 users here now
Star Trek memes and shitposts
Come on'n get your jamaharon on! There are no real rules—just don't break the weather control network.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Is that someone I should know?
Captain Jean-Luc Picard of the USS Enterprise.
I know that one what's the other guy
It's Mao Zedong. He said, "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." He also led China to mass starvation and terrible poverty, so not someone Picard would subscribe to.
Mao Zedong. Chairman Mao. The dude the Beatles sang about when they said you won’t make it with anyone if you carry pictures of him.
OP will now be unable to make it with anyone.
Mao Zedong; his quote was "Political power flows out of the barrel of a gun."
The quote is not a moral statement or a call to action, but a scientific analysis of Historical Materialism: the Chinese civil war was not fought with ballots or debates, it was fought with guns, on both sides.
Ultimately, the people with the guns hold all political power in society.
That's wrong in the context of the Chinese civil war though. Mao and the CPC didn't win because they had more guns or a more powerful army. In fact, the KMT almost wiped them out several times.
According to their own lore, they were more inspirational to the local people, who supported them in return. Mao specifically said "The guerrilla must move amongst the people as a fish swims in the sea."
You can read it in Mao's own words: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/113625.On_Guerrilla_Warfare
But this has been known from the days of Napoleon. A gun doesn't win a war, the idea wins the war. That's where ballots and debates come in.
When the CPC was losing to the KMT, they did not have more political power. I feel you're misunderstanding the quote, which is a colorful way of saying that force is the ultimate basis of all political power—which should be obvious from a cursory examination of international politics.
I think you're being overly simplistic - sure, ideas and debates have a place in politics. And "political power flows out of the barrel of a gun" doesn't mean "Whoever has the most guns wins" (though this is the case most of the time) - but it does mean that a group with no guns has no power.
Like the other commenter said, the quote is partially metaphorical - it just means that force is the basis of political power. The people willing and able to apply the most force will almost always win in the end.
Think about in America. If, tomorrow, 75% of Americans were in favor of abolishing the police, would it happen? Maybe, but probably not - because the people with political power, the people with guns and the will to use them (cops, troops, fascists, small business tyrants) support the police.
History is shaped by material conditions; ideas play a part in this, but material interest is the primary driving force.
You just said:
That directly contradicts Mao's idea that guerillas are supported by the people they live with. If the people withhold support, guerillas become like a fish out of water. Ordinary people (without guns) actually exercise more power in this scenario.
By focusing on guns instead of class, you are not using a Marxist or Neo-Marxist framework to analyze the civil war. You are using a Realist or Neo-Realist framework, similar to Henry Kissinger. Marxist frameworks believe class is much more important than guns.
The statement "political power flows from the barrel of a gun" is almost anti-Marxist in the way it completely ignores class conflict.