316
Hamas tells Gaza City residents to stay put after Israel orders evacuation
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 13 Oct 2023
316 points (96.5% liked)
World News
38969 readers
2010 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News [email protected]
Politics [email protected]
World Politics [email protected]
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I'm not sure it is reasonable to "defend" either side at this point. There are radical and moderate, innocent and guilty, peaceful and violent, reasonable and unreasonable people in both Palestine and Israel, and peace proposals have been made and rejected many times. I doubt many people outside of the situation have unlimited support for either side since both sides have committed atrocities.
I would guess that most observers realize that decades of alternating peace and war in Israel have shown that no lasting peace is possible until one side leaves.
After watching this conflict for 40 years, I have empathy fatigue. I don't really care who wins anymore, but this region has been a powder keg for too long. I also don't care whose "fault" it is anymore. All parties have to leave that behind and get to practical solutions. 75 years of unresolved active conflict is just too long.
Israel is too powerful. It will not be moved or defeated, and another all-out war by another coalition of Arab states will hurt the Palestinians as much as the Israelis. Nor will Israel ever allow the "right-of-return" of millions of Palestinians to Israel proper because then the Jews would be demographically overwhelmed. Therefore, the most practical, peaceful and humane, if not the most just or fair, solution is for most Palestinians to be properly re-settled outside of Israel, far from the Israeli border, where they can start new lives.
I think your sentiment is specifically against arabs. Would you be suggesting people like ukrainians to abandon their country to end the war that another, larger country started?
I love how so many people think the answer to the displaced Palestinians issue, is to evict every Israeli out of the middle East and displace a whole new generation of people. Coexistence is the only path forward but it isn't going to happen with natanyahu and Hamas in charge. The young people need to be given charge of their future
Boy that sure is a lot of words being put in my mouth
No, it has nothing to do with my having a preference for Jews over Arabs, or Ukrainians over Russians, for that matter. If Ukraine and Russia are still fighting and disrupting the region after 75 years, I would say the same thing. In fact, it is sad to say, but most experts think that Ukraine will probably have to trade away some territory for peace. My point is that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been going on for 75 years and won't be settled peacefully as long as Israelis and Palestinians occupy the same land, so some other solution is necessary.
I assume the same applies to the country Russia invades after Ukraine surrenders, like ukraine is after Crimea. And to the next region israel seeks to expand into for Zionism after palestinians are gone.
We are talking along different tracks. Creating the state of Israel in Palestine was obviously a huge mistake, and booting out the Palestinians is certainly unjust. We agree. But now what? People can wish for a more just solution, but 75 years of unresolved conflict and suffering in Israel suggests that less-than-ideal solutions should be considered.
Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe THIS TIME Israel and Palestine will figure out how to make a lasting peace. But I doubt it.
On their own? Of course not. It's a lesson we've learned before, aggressor states have to be addressed internationally. But currently, the aggressor state is the one being supported internationally. I dont think the people of Israel are like Russia, I think even just pausing aid on the condition that they stop the occupation of Palestinian territory would get them on board. Theyve created a humanitarian nightmare that needs addressing, that can be addressed with international help.
I don't think Israel is an aggressor state at all. Don't forget that Israel has withdrawn from Palestinian territory before, and the result is always more attacks. That's also why Israel still occupies the Golan Heights. Israel has always said that it will trade occupied territory for security guarantees, which no one can give as long as Hamas and Hezbollah are in charge and singularly bent on the destruction of Israel.
But, here we are, going down the same old tired narrative. All of this has been said and tried for decades. It's a frustrating quagmire for a reason. It's time for realpolitik, not another ideological crusade to gain justice for the Palestinian people. The Palestinians need to move on and be supported by the international community to do so. I know that isn't satisfying or fair, but I don't think that a good solution exists.
They should move on without food, water, or power?
Israel is blockading any humanitarian support for Gaza.
So.. In this case, Hamas is Russia and Israel is Ukraine. Hamas is the one who started the latest attack.
That wasnt the beginning of anything, this has been going on for a long time. The latest attacks have been in response to the humanitarian crisis Gaza has been experiencing from Israels blockade of Gazas border, and military occupation within the country. Israel is trying to eliminate Gaza.