▲ 845 ▼ Kevin McCarthy is ousted as House speaker in a historic vote pushed by conservatives (www.nbcnews.com) submitted 2 years ago by 18_24_61_b_17_17_4@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world 263 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] Alterforlett@lemmy.world 15 points 2 years ago (5 children) Eli5 on Joe Manchin please? Never heard of him permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] joshhsoj1902@lemmy.ca 61 points 2 years ago (3 children) He's a dem who doesn't seem to share any views with other Dems. He singlehandedly delayed or outright prevented many large bills from going through. When Bidens term is looked back upon, Manchin will be the force that prevented Biden from pushing though some of his more progressive plans. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] merc@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago (1 child) He doesn't always vote with the democrats, but if a republican had won that seat, they would be much more likely to side with the republicans. He hasn't done anything single-handedly, in every case where he gets blamed, it's because there's a huge Republican minority opposing something and he joins them. You can never blame him unless you're first blaming all the Republicans he's joining. He's a lightning rod because people think that for some reason he should vote with the democrats every time, but that's not realistic. He's a democrat from a very conservative state. The problem isn't Manchin, it's that they have to rely on Manchin and Sinema so much. If the democrats had a firm majority, his votes wouldn't matter. Instead he's often the deciding vote on something, so if he doesn't support it it fails. But, again, it would be worse if a Republican had won instead. Right now the senate is 51/49, and the Democrats can occasionally pass things. If Manchin had lost it would be 50/50 and they'd virtually never pass anything. When people look back at Biden's term, they'll note that it was the Republican who blocked everything, and that the 51/49 senate was too close to pass anything meaningful. Sinema and Manchin will probably get a mention, but anybody objective will note that it was the Republicans who blocked things, not Manchin and Sinema. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] TAG@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago Democrats can actually pass bills 50/50: if the US Senate ever has a tie vote, the Vice President gets to pick a winner. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RampantParanoia2365@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago (1 child) Which was 100% predictable and expected. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 2 points 2 years ago Including the fact that there are plenty of other Democratic senators who believe the same shit he does and vote accordingly but he's doing what he agreed to do as the public whipping boy. permalink fedilink source parent [–] frezik@midwest.social 7 points 2 years ago There are two things he's useful for: having a Democrat as Senate Majority Leader, and he actually does side with Dems on voting rights most of the time (even co-sponsoring bills). That's it. Other than that, might as well let the seat fall to a Republican for all the good he does. With his position as swing vote, Manchin is arguably the most powerful person in the world. He's doing fuck all with that power besides obstructing things. If I were a W. Virginia voter with sense, I would be asking how he's using his position to help W. Virginia. You want to bring jobs and industry and sweet government pork to your state, Joe? You're in a prime position to do it. permalink fedilink source parent [–] deksesuma@lemmy.world 50 points 2 years ago* (3 children) Democratic senator from an otherwise red state. He tends to be a spoiler for Democratic plans, along with Kristen Synema. If the GOP was closer to the center, he would likely switch parties. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (3 children) from an otherwise red state Not really, his voters overwhelmingly support progressive policies. It's just no progressive has a chance in the primary with the party blocking all of Manchin's primary opponents. It has been on a downswing lately tho. 2016 there was more D than R voters, and 2021 it got tied up. I do t know why everyone acts like all these "red states" are worth writing off, it really wouldn't be hard if we actually tried for them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] jscummy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago I don't know where you're getting there being more D than R voters in WV. The last two presidential elections went to Trump by 40 points permalink fedilink source parent [–] SCB@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* Manchin is a senator, which means the election is state-wide, and West Virginia is a deeply red state. A Progressive candidate has 0 chance in West Virginia and any claim otherwise is quite simply wishful thinking. Let's leave the Bernie Math in 2016 permalink fedilink source parent [–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world -3 points 2 years ago Ugh I'm not gonna try like a little fuckwit permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child) He's not all bad. He has let the democrats get through as many judges as possible. That said, he is a bad look for the party hands down. He allows moderates to believe democrats have a plurality when really they are just being lead by the people the least to the left. So when things go wrong it was the other 48's fault but not really. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) You mean christofascist supreme court justices? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 4 points 2 years ago No, the various federal benches. Which, incidentally, were the only federal positions that Trump had been filling with any urgency. Ambassadors and heads of departments all went unfilled, but not judges. So now the federal bench is stuffed with Trump appointees, and Democrats are only pushing back a bit. If they had any sense, they'd quadruple the size of the federal judiciary and stuff it back up. The size hasn't been increased in a while, and the workload per judge has been pilling up, so there's a good reason to do this, anyway. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child) ... no Joe Manchin has not helped the democrats appoint any christofascist Supreme Court Justices. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Alterforlett@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago Thank you permalink fedilink source parent [–] moneyinphx@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago He's a bitch boi permalink fedilink source parent [–] mayo@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago* He's like the swing vote guy, or one of them. Votes against party policy. Summary of voting record: opposes big business, environmental protection, financial sector regulation, gun control, hawkish foreign policy, foreign and humanitarian aid, taxing the middle class, military spending, domestic surveillance. Supports taxing businesses, restrict money in politics, consumer protection, disaster relief, funding education, public health, labor rights and wages, lgbt rights, internet freedom, a robust safety net, higher spending, women's rights. Came across this site looking up an answer for you. http://politicsthatwork.com/voting-record/Joe-Manchin-412391 Worth looking at it in more detail because he did vote to support abortion restriction so idk about supporting women's rights etc. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Uranium3006@kbin.social 1 point 2 years ago He's the dem senator from west Virginia. He's a coal barron we put up with because if he lost a Republican would most likely take his seat. He's the Senate's kingmaker permalink fedilink source parent
[–] joshhsoj1902@lemmy.ca 61 points 2 years ago (3 children) He's a dem who doesn't seem to share any views with other Dems. He singlehandedly delayed or outright prevented many large bills from going through. When Bidens term is looked back upon, Manchin will be the force that prevented Biden from pushing though some of his more progressive plans. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] merc@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago (1 child) He doesn't always vote with the democrats, but if a republican had won that seat, they would be much more likely to side with the republicans. He hasn't done anything single-handedly, in every case where he gets blamed, it's because there's a huge Republican minority opposing something and he joins them. You can never blame him unless you're first blaming all the Republicans he's joining. He's a lightning rod because people think that for some reason he should vote with the democrats every time, but that's not realistic. He's a democrat from a very conservative state. The problem isn't Manchin, it's that they have to rely on Manchin and Sinema so much. If the democrats had a firm majority, his votes wouldn't matter. Instead he's often the deciding vote on something, so if he doesn't support it it fails. But, again, it would be worse if a Republican had won instead. Right now the senate is 51/49, and the Democrats can occasionally pass things. If Manchin had lost it would be 50/50 and they'd virtually never pass anything. When people look back at Biden's term, they'll note that it was the Republican who blocked everything, and that the 51/49 senate was too close to pass anything meaningful. Sinema and Manchin will probably get a mention, but anybody objective will note that it was the Republicans who blocked things, not Manchin and Sinema. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] TAG@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago Democrats can actually pass bills 50/50: if the US Senate ever has a tie vote, the Vice President gets to pick a winner. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RampantParanoia2365@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago (1 child) Which was 100% predictable and expected. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 2 points 2 years ago Including the fact that there are plenty of other Democratic senators who believe the same shit he does and vote accordingly but he's doing what he agreed to do as the public whipping boy. permalink fedilink source parent [–] frezik@midwest.social 7 points 2 years ago There are two things he's useful for: having a Democrat as Senate Majority Leader, and he actually does side with Dems on voting rights most of the time (even co-sponsoring bills). That's it. Other than that, might as well let the seat fall to a Republican for all the good he does. With his position as swing vote, Manchin is arguably the most powerful person in the world. He's doing fuck all with that power besides obstructing things. If I were a W. Virginia voter with sense, I would be asking how he's using his position to help W. Virginia. You want to bring jobs and industry and sweet government pork to your state, Joe? You're in a prime position to do it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago (1 child) He doesn't always vote with the democrats, but if a republican had won that seat, they would be much more likely to side with the republicans. He hasn't done anything single-handedly, in every case where he gets blamed, it's because there's a huge Republican minority opposing something and he joins them. You can never blame him unless you're first blaming all the Republicans he's joining. He's a lightning rod because people think that for some reason he should vote with the democrats every time, but that's not realistic. He's a democrat from a very conservative state. The problem isn't Manchin, it's that they have to rely on Manchin and Sinema so much. If the democrats had a firm majority, his votes wouldn't matter. Instead he's often the deciding vote on something, so if he doesn't support it it fails. But, again, it would be worse if a Republican had won instead. Right now the senate is 51/49, and the Democrats can occasionally pass things. If Manchin had lost it would be 50/50 and they'd virtually never pass anything. When people look back at Biden's term, they'll note that it was the Republican who blocked everything, and that the 51/49 senate was too close to pass anything meaningful. Sinema and Manchin will probably get a mention, but anybody objective will note that it was the Republicans who blocked things, not Manchin and Sinema. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] TAG@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago Democrats can actually pass bills 50/50: if the US Senate ever has a tie vote, the Vice President gets to pick a winner. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] TAG@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago Democrats can actually pass bills 50/50: if the US Senate ever has a tie vote, the Vice President gets to pick a winner. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RampantParanoia2365@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago (1 child) Which was 100% predictable and expected. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 2 points 2 years ago Including the fact that there are plenty of other Democratic senators who believe the same shit he does and vote accordingly but he's doing what he agreed to do as the public whipping boy. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 2 points 2 years ago Including the fact that there are plenty of other Democratic senators who believe the same shit he does and vote accordingly but he's doing what he agreed to do as the public whipping boy. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 7 points 2 years ago There are two things he's useful for: having a Democrat as Senate Majority Leader, and he actually does side with Dems on voting rights most of the time (even co-sponsoring bills). That's it. Other than that, might as well let the seat fall to a Republican for all the good he does. With his position as swing vote, Manchin is arguably the most powerful person in the world. He's doing fuck all with that power besides obstructing things. If I were a W. Virginia voter with sense, I would be asking how he's using his position to help W. Virginia. You want to bring jobs and industry and sweet government pork to your state, Joe? You're in a prime position to do it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] deksesuma@lemmy.world 50 points 2 years ago* (3 children) Democratic senator from an otherwise red state. He tends to be a spoiler for Democratic plans, along with Kristen Synema. If the GOP was closer to the center, he would likely switch parties. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (3 children) from an otherwise red state Not really, his voters overwhelmingly support progressive policies. It's just no progressive has a chance in the primary with the party blocking all of Manchin's primary opponents. It has been on a downswing lately tho. 2016 there was more D than R voters, and 2021 it got tied up. I do t know why everyone acts like all these "red states" are worth writing off, it really wouldn't be hard if we actually tried for them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] jscummy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago I don't know where you're getting there being more D than R voters in WV. The last two presidential elections went to Trump by 40 points permalink fedilink source parent [–] SCB@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* Manchin is a senator, which means the election is state-wide, and West Virginia is a deeply red state. A Progressive candidate has 0 chance in West Virginia and any claim otherwise is quite simply wishful thinking. Let's leave the Bernie Math in 2016 permalink fedilink source parent [–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world -3 points 2 years ago Ugh I'm not gonna try like a little fuckwit permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child) He's not all bad. He has let the democrats get through as many judges as possible. That said, he is a bad look for the party hands down. He allows moderates to believe democrats have a plurality when really they are just being lead by the people the least to the left. So when things go wrong it was the other 48's fault but not really. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) You mean christofascist supreme court justices? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 4 points 2 years ago No, the various federal benches. Which, incidentally, were the only federal positions that Trump had been filling with any urgency. Ambassadors and heads of departments all went unfilled, but not judges. So now the federal bench is stuffed with Trump appointees, and Democrats are only pushing back a bit. If they had any sense, they'd quadruple the size of the federal judiciary and stuff it back up. The size hasn't been increased in a while, and the workload per judge has been pilling up, so there's a good reason to do this, anyway. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child) ... no Joe Manchin has not helped the democrats appoint any christofascist Supreme Court Justices. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Alterforlett@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago Thank you permalink fedilink source parent
[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago (3 children) from an otherwise red state Not really, his voters overwhelmingly support progressive policies. It's just no progressive has a chance in the primary with the party blocking all of Manchin's primary opponents. It has been on a downswing lately tho. 2016 there was more D than R voters, and 2021 it got tied up. I do t know why everyone acts like all these "red states" are worth writing off, it really wouldn't be hard if we actually tried for them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] jscummy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago I don't know where you're getting there being more D than R voters in WV. The last two presidential elections went to Trump by 40 points permalink fedilink source parent [–] SCB@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* Manchin is a senator, which means the election is state-wide, and West Virginia is a deeply red state. A Progressive candidate has 0 chance in West Virginia and any claim otherwise is quite simply wishful thinking. Let's leave the Bernie Math in 2016 permalink fedilink source parent [–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world -3 points 2 years ago Ugh I'm not gonna try like a little fuckwit permalink fedilink source parent
[–] jscummy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago I don't know where you're getting there being more D than R voters in WV. The last two presidential elections went to Trump by 40 points permalink fedilink source parent
[–] SCB@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* Manchin is a senator, which means the election is state-wide, and West Virginia is a deeply red state. A Progressive candidate has 0 chance in West Virginia and any claim otherwise is quite simply wishful thinking. Let's leave the Bernie Math in 2016 permalink fedilink source parent
[–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world -3 points 2 years ago Ugh I'm not gonna try like a little fuckwit permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 12 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child) He's not all bad. He has let the democrats get through as many judges as possible. That said, he is a bad look for the party hands down. He allows moderates to believe democrats have a plurality when really they are just being lead by the people the least to the left. So when things go wrong it was the other 48's fault but not really. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) You mean christofascist supreme court justices? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 4 points 2 years ago No, the various federal benches. Which, incidentally, were the only federal positions that Trump had been filling with any urgency. Ambassadors and heads of departments all went unfilled, but not judges. So now the federal bench is stuffed with Trump appointees, and Democrats are only pushing back a bit. If they had any sense, they'd quadruple the size of the federal judiciary and stuff it back up. The size hasn't been increased in a while, and the workload per judge has been pilling up, so there's a good reason to do this, anyway. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child) ... no Joe Manchin has not helped the democrats appoint any christofascist Supreme Court Justices. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) You mean christofascist supreme court justices? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 4 points 2 years ago No, the various federal benches. Which, incidentally, were the only federal positions that Trump had been filling with any urgency. Ambassadors and heads of departments all went unfilled, but not judges. So now the federal bench is stuffed with Trump appointees, and Democrats are only pushing back a bit. If they had any sense, they'd quadruple the size of the federal judiciary and stuff it back up. The size hasn't been increased in a while, and the workload per judge has been pilling up, so there's a good reason to do this, anyway. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child) ... no Joe Manchin has not helped the democrats appoint any christofascist Supreme Court Justices. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 4 points 2 years ago No, the various federal benches. Which, incidentally, were the only federal positions that Trump had been filling with any urgency. Ambassadors and heads of departments all went unfilled, but not judges. So now the federal bench is stuffed with Trump appointees, and Democrats are only pushing back a bit. If they had any sense, they'd quadruple the size of the federal judiciary and stuff it back up. The size hasn't been increased in a while, and the workload per judge has been pilling up, so there's a good reason to do this, anyway. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child) ... no Joe Manchin has not helped the democrats appoint any christofascist Supreme Court Justices. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] blazeknave@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) ??? No, he helped the fucking Republicans do it. Wtf man? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago The Republicans didn't need his help. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mayo@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago* He's like the swing vote guy, or one of them. Votes against party policy. Summary of voting record: opposes big business, environmental protection, financial sector regulation, gun control, hawkish foreign policy, foreign and humanitarian aid, taxing the middle class, military spending, domestic surveillance. Supports taxing businesses, restrict money in politics, consumer protection, disaster relief, funding education, public health, labor rights and wages, lgbt rights, internet freedom, a robust safety net, higher spending, women's rights. Came across this site looking up an answer for you. http://politicsthatwork.com/voting-record/Joe-Manchin-412391 Worth looking at it in more detail because he did vote to support abortion restriction so idk about supporting women's rights etc. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Uranium3006@kbin.social 1 point 2 years ago He's the dem senator from west Virginia. He's a coal barron we put up with because if he lost a Republican would most likely take his seat. He's the Senate's kingmaker permalink fedilink source parent