this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
686 points (95.5% liked)

Technology

58133 readers
4509 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related content.
  3. Be excellent to each another!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed

Approved Bots


founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Your implementation of my concept might be useless, but that doesn’t mean the concept is.

One possible solution would be to look at how responses are structured, letter frequencies, etc. The flexibility/ambiguous nature natural language is that you can word things in many many different ways which allows for some creative meta techniques to accomplish a fingerprint.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

It is a valid idea, and not impossible. When generating text, a language model gives a list of possible tokens.. or more correctly it gives a weight to every possible token where most would be 0 weight. Then there's multiple ways to pick the next token, from always picking top one to select random from top X tokens to mirostat and so on. You could probably do some extra weighting to embed a sort of signature. At some quality loss

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The idea itself is valid, but wouldn’t that just make it more dangerous when malicious agents use the technology without fingerprinting?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Cats out of the bag my friend. Just like the nuke, the ideas are always out there. Once it’s been discovered and shared that’s that.

We can huff and puff and come up with all the cute little laws we want but the fact of the matter is we know the recipe now. All we can do is dive deeper into the technology to understand it even better, make new findings and adapt as we always do.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Not sure if you’re disagreeing or agreeing with me. What I mean is, if a LLM’s output is in practice indistinguishable from human output, fingerprinting some popular services just creates a false sense of security, since we know malicious agents will for sure not fingerprint it.

Isn’t it just better to let humanity accept that a LLM’s output is identical to a person’s and always be skeptical?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

To be honest with you I’m torn on the subject.

I don’t think it’s fair to abandon the idea that it’s possible to get a reliable fingerprint to differentiate between some hypothetical LLM/NLP AI and humans. I haven’t been convinced it’s impossible to tweak things purposefully to make them inherently produce a fingerprint every single time to help differentiate.

I just think we need more time, so I guess I’m abstaining?