you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 95 points 1 year ago (22 children)

Hey I studied this in grad school for a bit, and it really is just "someone does some dumb shit which leads to a cascading wave of additional people doing dumb shit which propagates backwards for miles." Basically when the offered load is getting close to the maximum load, all it takes is one person aggressively changing lanes to throw that section of highway into gridlock, and it will remain that way until the total integrated traffic flux across that incident boundary again falls below the critical offered load inflection point.

Basically, pick a lane and just stay in it. Maintain proper following distance. Counterintuitively, the following distance should be for the speed you want to drive, so even in traffic it should be like 5+ car lengths even though you are going slow. This is because it reduces the offered load, and once that number falls below the critical point, speeds will increase again. Bumper to bumper traffic basically prevents that from happening because it dampens the ability for a "speedup" wave to propagate.

Of course this is all impossible for humans. All it takes is a few idiots to throw off the balance.

  • source
  • hideshow 22 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    Yep! All it takes is one person braking, and then the person behind braking, then the person behind them, and eith each braking the overall speed slows down more and more. It creates a wave of traffic. The wave passes through. The starting point I think moves back further and further.

    I think about it a lot while I sit in traffic.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] -4 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    I think the issue is more or less slow drivers. One asshole is going 60 in a 70 in the left lane which caused people to pass them which in turn cause the cascade from the maneuvering around the slow person.

    Slow drivers are far more dangerous than people don't 10 15 over the speed limit.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    You are incorrect. You are the cause of the traffic jam lol, literally.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    Why is Driving Slower than Other Vehicles Just as Dangerous as Speeding? https://share.google/U82ugU39Gc0XOa55G

    A Few Slow Drivers Increase the Number of Accidents https://share.google/SUYjn8eEkNNLe5xBO

    Slow Drivers: Dangers of Driving Slow | Allstate https://share.google/7GP2waFViHMUqEJYj

    Some times you people don't even know what you're downvoting.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Are you trying to suggest that driving at higher speeds is safer than driving at lower speeds? Because that goes against the laws of physics

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    That is exactly what I'm suggesting. And so are the sources I provided.

    But let me be clear. People who go slow on purpose in high speed areas are a danger for people trying to go faster. I'm not taking about people speeding recklessly. I'm talking people going 60 in a 70 or 20 in a 35. They cause other drivers to maneuver around them which could cause a situation.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    If people pass quickly, then get out of the left lane, nobody needs to brake and start a compression wave

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [+] -6 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    "Pick a lane and stay in it" leads to slow drivers blocking the left lane, no?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    You have demonstrated why fundamentally humans suck at driving and this problem is unsolvable.

    Not because you asked the question but because it's not intuitive why.

    So long as this has to be explained to anyone it can't be solved.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I'm genuinely curious: are there adverse effects to an arrangement where the right lane is used by large trucks going 90-100 kph, middle lanes used for normal traffic going 120-130 kph and the left lane kept open for faster traffic? As far as I understand, these issues arise when cars go back and forth between lanes all the time, or when cars go slower than the ones behind them without an open lane to overtake them. If you pick a lane and stay in it, you might cause the second issue

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    From a purely traffic load perspective, the whole "fast lane" thing doesn't make a huge difference, and the aggressive obsession with it is actually a big part of the psychology which creates traffic in the first place. Traffic capacity is generally optimized when everyone is traveling close to the same speed and has enough following distance to safely maintain that speed, which is why speed limits are set for the slowest road users. Just in general, speed does not increase road capacity beyond a certain fairly low limit because it requires dramatically increased following distance, or in the absence of such responsible behavior, it massively increases the frequency of traffic disruption.

    The worst case is a few people traveling much faster than the slowest road users, as these few users both take up more space, and cause more disruption. The "fast lane" concept is rooted firmly in an unfortunate behavioral reality and has basically no real scientific basis beyond that. Even if you had perfect robot drivers with perfect reaction time and the ability to see far ahead of themselves, the critical capacity speed only increases slightly because the maximum stoping distance is still limited by rubber and asphalt.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I’m a little confused about the mechanism of the speeders causing the disruption. Is it because when they cut in front of someone closely, it causes the driver to hit the brakes to make more room, thus triggering the chain reaction?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment