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It's the intention that matters?
(lemmy.world)
¯\(ツ)/¯
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this post was submitted on 29 May 2025
227 points (96.7% liked)
Enough Musk Spam
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This is less a response exclusively to this post and more the Tesla discourse broadly
I get we really wanna find people to hate because it makes us feel better about how deeply broken our world is but a lot of folks bought teslas long before we knew Elon would undergo his transformation into a public nazi.
Having bought a product from a person who later turns out to be a huge piece of shit doesn't make you a bad person. And cars are major financial choices that depreciate MASSIVELY the moment they're yours.
I get we all wanna say "Tesla expensive therefore they're rich and they can afford to blow another massive sum of money on another car to replace the tesla", but like... A) lots of Tesla drives are not rich. They're the exact people we have to remind that they are still dirty poors compared to the actual rich people that we need to tax way more. And even for people pretty well off, blowing that kind of money on a purely performative, symbolic replacement of a product they already gave Elon money for is an objectively dumb choice.
We have mocked conservatives for dumb boycotts where they burn their shoes or dump out all their beer from a brand they no linger respect, but we turn around and set the expectation that others with a product we don't like follow exact same logic for what is the second largest category of purchase most people will ever make in their life.
For all the people who will never be able to afford a house because we live in a capitalist hellscape it's the most expensive category of purchase there is. And it depreciates massively the instant it became theirs.
I'm all for mocking cybertruck owners, they bought a shit car, from a shit man, and more importantly they gave him a lot of money knowing how dangerous and horrible he is.
But owning a Tesla doesn't immediately make you a bad person and a fascist. For a lot of people it means you bought the best made electric car on the market because you care about the environment.
"Best EV on the market"? Not by a long shot, I don't think.
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That article is from 2025, many people bought their teslas at a time when the largest well known "competitor" was the Nisan leaf, a car built with less engineering competency/care than a tin can of beans. The batteries have no active cooling system meaning that one of the most expensive components in the car is going to loose a meaningful amount of lifespan every time you use it, degrading an already crap range
Now the market has lots of good options, but there was a hoooot minute where Tesla was way ahead of anyone else and the best option an environmentally conscious shopper who wanted a new car or an electric car could choose (since EVs weren't widely available on the used market until we got enough of them. Whole convo to be had about whether it was better to buy used or a new electric but that's beside the point)
Edit to add context: the first consumer Tesla models came out in 2010
Yes, it's from 2025, because as you say, the people who bought their Tesla before we all realized just how much of a lunatic Musk is can't really be blamed.
But nowadays that's no longer true, and case in point, there are better or at least similar options in the market.
Yep, totally agree. In the same price bracket I've heard good things about Rivian. But I really haven't followed electric cars now that there are a lot of good ones, I just remember following the progression of tesla and wondering when other companies would start producing alternatives and catch up.
I drive a 2021 Kona Electric. It's a fantastic vehicle.
People have no sympathy for Tesla drivers because they gave tens of thousands of dollars to Elon Musk
If they did that prior to it being widely known that he's a fascist I'm not sure how that's supposed to reflect their moral character. And sure Elon has always been a dumbass but so is basically every CEO, and you don't see us going around saying "you bought a Ford, you're a horrible human". The only difference is that Elon is a public figure, and now a public Nazi. But he hasn't always been a public nazi, and buying one of his cars before he was doesn't meaninfully reflect on the character of the person who made that choice.
A lot of people liked Kanye before his manic decent into "Hitler was a good dude actually" and I wouldn't bash people for owning Kanye music, especially from before that progressive mental break (Progressive as in incremental and progressing over time, not politically progressive)
It's not really "sympathy" to not attack people for making a choice they couldn't have known would support an especially horrible CEO, rather than just a regularly horrible one.
Elon Musk has been observably vile since at least 2018
The first consumer Tesla models came out in 2010. 15 years ago. And even then not everyone keeps tabs on what's up with the CEO of the company they're buying a car from, and is "observing" whether they're being a crappy human.
He only became an actually important public figure to be aware of and pay attention to more recently. The whole discussion framing Tesla owners as bad people does exactly nothing to improve any of the problems we're facing, it just needlessly antagonizes people and makes them feel guilty for something they very well may have done cause they just care about the electrification of cars as a means towards a healthier environment.
The only real purpose it serves is 1) advertising how angry you are about the problem which is worthless, and 2) let's people tell themselves they're fighting the good fight and being a good person by antagonizing random people.
So much of left wing culture feels like it's about sanctimoniously labeling people villians because it let's us feel better about ourselves. Its worse than a waste of energy. I feel we can do better.
Tldr
I'm literally just stating a fact that Tesla owners will be targeted because of their car, and there isn't an excuse after 15 years for why someone wouldn't dump their toxic car if they were legitimately concerned about being targeted.
The excuse is that that's a horrible financial decision for literally exactly zero benefit at a time where it's getting harder and harder to survive?????
I will never understand the insistence that is is good and right and justified to target people for random shit. Like making a bad purchase warrants being bullied or getting your shit vandalised.
I cannot fathom the system of priorities you seem to opperate under. Where performative gestures that cost you huge sums of money and don't accomplish anything are some kind of twisted social obligation because you bought a car from someone who turned out to suck more than anyone realized. And if you don't make that objectively bad life choice then you had it coming.
Thats fucking unhinged. Who does that help??? Go outside. Talk to your neighbors. Ground yourself in meaningful connections with other people. We wanna build socialism but have created a culture that seems to celebrate being emotionally incapable of building social bonds of any kind with anyone who isn't a mirror image of our every choice and priority. Shit makes me sad.
Again, this isn't random, the people who dislike Tesla have very specific reasons, pretending like you don't understand is getting tiring to hear.
You don't get to make bad decisions and have everyone coddle you for it..
I won't enable you here no matter how hard you whine.
Americans get so fucking touchy about a fucking car.
Grow up and learn to engage with reality instead of defaulting to clutching pearls and pretending like I'm just a meanie head
A billionaire who you bought a car from just attempted to overthrow the country.
Yes, and lots of peope who bought said car justifiably had no idea he was a fascist.
Those people still chose poorly in purchasing a tesla. They were never well build cars to begin with. Many issues with reliability, poor build quality, and poor engineering choices. There was no excuse to purchase even then; if you bought one that is on you.
You're not wrong that they have lots of issues though those build quality problems did go wildly under reported for a looong time, and there wasn't exactly any meaningful EV competition. Plus some issues have definitely gotten worse over time, they did used to be a bit better. The removal of sonar to focus solely on optical cameras being an obvious choice
But I don't know that it's really productive to bash people because they made a suboptimal purchase. The ethical argument I understand, but isn't really applicable to a lot of tesla owners
That hasn't always been the case. It's hard to imagine now, but 5-10 years ago electric car options were pretty limited especially if you wanted one that had a good range and didn't look ugly as fuck. Not only that, but at the time Elon was just "regular rich guy" bad and not openly fascist. I don't blame anyone for buying a Tesla back then.
This is highly highly dependent on how. Your basing the decision. For MPGe or equivalent. Telsas rank in the top few. So these results need to be clarified with how this conclusion was made.
The linked article does include that explanation, so go read if you care.
I don't think that's too important, because the point was that there are Tesla alternatives nowadays you can choose from, so you don't have to buy one.
Every single one of those cars is an entry level eco shit box. And if that's what you need fantastic.
But best, belongs nowhere near that list. Those are inexpensive.
Car experts: "We've driven all of these cars, so here's a list of which EVs we think are best and why."
Random troll: "Nah all shit cause cheap."
¯_(ツ)_/¯
My tesla model 3 2021 model had all the features I wanted in an electric car like a heatpump, lane assist, good infotainment and a lot more. Sure, some of those cars had around the same entry price, but the features would've made them a lot more expensive than my SR.
So you think a $23000 Clio with cloth seats, a 7 second 0-60, and half the range is better than a Tesla with twice the range? Or a taycan with the range and features? Our a loaded Mach E? or the id buzz?
Definitely a top 10 right here 🤣
Define better for you. The article gives their reasons.
But if you're all caught up in that, just go check some other list. Here's Top Gear's. They have the Renault 5e as #1, followed by the Hyundai Ioniq 5N, Roll-Royce Specter and the Porsche Taycan.
The point is that there are better, or at least similar, alternatives to Tesla nowadays, and if you're buying a Model 3 today, you're doing it by choice.
👌 I'm glad you found a list that isn't trash. Must have been hard while you try to redefine best to fit your point.
Google search result #2. Sweating from exertion.
Point was always that nowadays Tesla isn't the only, or even the best, option on EVs.
That is a perfectly valid frustration lol. I've not noticed that but I can empathize with noticing patterns in which brand owners drive like dicks.
This is inaccurate. It is not even close to the best made electric car on the market, it is not even a well made car, period.
Was. It was the best made electric car on the market. For a loooong time. For a long time there were barely any other choices at all, nevermind good choices.
The market has now caught up, and elon musk has announced himself to be a Nazi. Exactly zero good reasons left to buy a Tesla. But it explicitly was the best option by a landslide for quite a while, assuming you could afford one.
As someone who was really excited about electric cars I sat waiting for a long time trying to see when they would have meaningful competition. Its there now, but it sure as hell didn't used to be.
Edit: double checked and the first consumer models of tesla came out in 2010. They're that old. I think people who weren't paying attention to cars and EVs might not have realized just how long there were no meaningful competitors.
As a current Tesla Model Y owner I appreciate this post.
I can also state emphatically that I’m “one and done” with Tesla. I’ll never buy another car from them as long as Musk is involved in any way with the company. Even before he started kissing MAGA ass I realized his heavy handed technology decisions with the cars was a turn off. While there are a few unique features I like, I hate having to dig through touch screen menus just to do things like turn on the windshield wipers. The unique features just aren’t enough to overlook all those other poor usability decisions.
Totally valid. You're not a bad person. People are just justifiably angry and it makes them better to find people who's head they can tell themselves it's okay to put on a pike.
It kinda feels like a big problem in very left leaning spaces that people would rather prioritize doing the thing that demonstrates their anger, or let's them take their anger out on someone, than actually think about what way of engaging with the problem would be productive 😅. Personally I find that super frustrating and think it's will guarantee we can't meaningfully address the rise of fascism
Anyway, hope you have a good day, take care! :)
Owning a Tesla doesn't make you a bad person that's right, but Elon was a complete idiot at least since his PayPal time.
That's entirely fair. Though I don't know that many people research the CEO of the company they're buying a car from, and I imagine if we did we'd not have a huge number of options left 😅
That's right and I don't blame anyone who bought a Tesla or anything really (except that you have to be out of your mind to buy a car without knobs 🤣 for that price) and people still buy from Amazon and Nestle and I don't blame them either. That's actually something that politics would have to solve, but that's an entirely different story.
Lol, yeah I can't stomach a car with no knobs either. Objectively bad ux. No thank you lol.
People supporting oil companies do not have the moral high ground here just because the fascist, murderous billionaires they support financially have the good sense to not do Nazi salutes on a stage. They're still responsible for incredible amounts of suffering and death, ongoing.
There are other options besides teslas. There were ZERO options besides oil based engines before electric cars became a thing if you are disabled and cant ride a bike or walk.
The competitors only exist because Tesla succeeded, and they are not better. Every car company has spent money lobbying for less regulation on gas cars. Every car company has donated massive amounts of money to the Republican party. Every car company has had scandals driven by insane greed and disregard for human life, like VW and their diesel engine.
People act like Elon Musk invented being a shitty billionaire, but Henry Ford and Rockefeller were doing it long before Musk was born, and VW was the literal Nazimobile. The entire industry was built by shitty people, sustained by shitty people, and continues to be shitty to this day. If you drive a car, you don't get a choice of whether to financially support a piece of shit, you just get to choose which one, and taking it out on one group of largely progressive people who at least give a shit about the environment is counterproductive and stupid.
Imagine if we all broadly put a fraction of a fraction of the effort we put into performative boycotts and infighting into actually getting involved in our local communities, organizing, fundraising and getting to know our local representatives.
You know, the things that have allowed capitalism to have unfettered access to our highest offices. The things that get ZERO media coverage and less hype, even broadly made fun of as lame or pathetic. If we cared at all about our local community and who represents us closest, we would have at least slowed down this march of endless growth that has made each of us into a commodity who thinks we're winning when we talk about brands and boycotts.
Yeah, but why do that when we can be sanctimoniously mean to others while feeling morally superior to everyone else?
Ideology built on pluralism and we're having debate about whether it's cool to be mean to people because they made a choice we don't like (with the fucking benefit of hindsight). Surely if we're mean to people it'll solve all our problems right???
Sorry clearly I'm no longer capable of engaging with people productively and should step away from the keyboard lol. I 100% agree. There are so many things worth our emotional energy. Bullying people and arguing why they deserve to be targeted maybe isn't one of them 🙃🙃🙃
I want off this ride lol.
Over the last few decades (i'm an online oldie) I have watched as the conversation spaces changed broadly from "places where we engage with ideas and argue our values" to "places where we pretend to debate people we don't agree with for attention from our own side" to now, "places where we viciously rip out the throats of people in our own groups because it's so much easier to purity-test your kinsmen than it is to actually go try to change someone's mind."
This is kinda silly and sad on its own, it becomes horrifying when you realize that most of these people, left and right, have this idea that they're going to someday "win" and that "someone is going to do something." And as a result don't ever pause to think about the fact that even if everything went our way tomorrow, we would still have to live next to millions of people who don't agree with you and nothing is going to end unless we actually do hard things like talk to people we've been taught to hate.
Boycotting Tesla isn't performative. Elon owns 12% of Tesla. Tesla's net profit per car is $8k. 12% of $8k is $960. Tesla stock has a PE ratio of 200x. $960 x 200 = $192,000.
That's right, every Tesla sold is worth $192,000 to Elon in stock value.
Elon uses that value to support Trump and overthrow Democracy worldwide.
I believe the part they consider performative is just the expectation that people who already have them need to get rid of them, sustaining a really big personal loss with no direct benefit in terms of hurting teslas bottom line. But I can see how their exact phrasing could be ambiguous what they really mean