this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2023
176 points (100.0% liked)
Blahaj Lemmy Meta
2302 readers
3 users here now
Blåhaj Lemmy is a Lemmy instance attached to blahaj.zone. This is a group for questions or discussions relevant to either instance.
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Then by your logic you cannot be pro US or pro NATO and be LGBT. Funny
I don't know why NATO even matters. Well I know why it is brought up, but seriously I won't even entertain that.
What makes you think that I even would want to visit the US? I wouldn't feel safe there for many reasons.
I don't know what else to tell you. I don't understand how you can in all seriousness support your position without glossing over all the anti humanistic and anti LGBT+ things going on. I doubt I can say anything to make you understand why that's a line I like many others won't ever cross.
Oh, so you are anti NATO then, yes? You are outspoken against every country that has ever had anti LGBT laws? Or are you being disingenuous because you are an anti communist? 🤔
Why would I care about NATO in this context? Unless it is supposed to be sone stupid pro Putin argument or so. I don't support the military and that should be enough of this.
And yes, I am outspoken about unequal laws. Why should I be outspoken against countries that ever had any and presumely not anymore? That's a weird take. I don't have the power to fix the world, but I still have an opinion and a long list of countries I'd refuse to visit.
Why some economical system even matters in this discussion is another point I don't really understand. I never made my own position clear, because it does not matter in the slightest. I am for a social and democratic system which cares about the needs of everyone equally and it does not really matter how it is implemented or what you call it if it does actually work. Post scarcity communism is the optimal state we could maybe archive in a few hundred or thousand years, but until then we have to take one step at a time. Right now it is a utopic idea and seriously irrelevant to this discussion. Does that sound like anti communist to you? Not that it really matters.
Sorry, but my world isn't as black and white as you think it is.
This is 100% just me having a Pavlovian response to that word, but is there even the slimmest chance I could interest you in reading Socialism: Utopian and Scientific by Friedrich Engels? Here's a text online and here's a great, free audiobook.
You are right that FALGSC is a utopian idea (depending on what specifically you mean) and therefore not relevant, but it's so not relevant that I wonder why you mention it?
Oh, right, okay, that makes sense. I think you have misconceptions about Marxism if you believe Marxists would not describe their views in roughly these terms. The text I linked discusses that topic in some level of detail, in the broader context of historical social progress and other socialist theorists.
No, I mentioned it because I know that the ideas are compatible. They don't necessitate each other though. The economic system does not matter if (!) you can achieve the goals otherwise and was a direct reply to the idea that I might be anti communist which is obviously not the case. The full answer to this is much more complicated though.
That "if" does a lot of work, as you allude to, and also happens to be relevant to the text I linked since it turns out politics and economics aren't separable except as mental abstractions. I'm not a communist because I want co-ops (I think they are fine but overrated by radlibs and a small number of leftists), I'm a communist because I believe the class that should control the state should be the proletariat (by means of democracy, since they are the vast majority) rather than the bourgeoisie (who control it in neoliberal states by buying out politicians and media), and "ownership" of the means of production is secondary to this. The proletariat controls what the bourgeoisie "own" if the proletariat controls the state and use it against the bourgeoisie such that the latter only persist as a class at the convenience of the former.
I don't see how you think the economic system doesn't matter? That's a BIG if
NATO encompasses tons of homophobic contries. That and it supports Western hegemony which is harmful to most of the world, including queer people.