My reason for posting this question is to get some perspective, since I don't live further west than Indiana.
Indiana has a lot of conservative tendencies, usually opposes progressive policies, and a little old school bigotry in the form of religion based disagreement with people's life styles, like letter community.
From an outsiders perspective, TX, OK, MO etc are even more extreme.
This permalink above from a comment from a person referencing recently proposed legislation against letter community people specifically, though there's tons of examples of bigotry like the school principal getting sued for discrimination due to a kid's hair (black hair).
We know Lemmy is a bit more populated with left than right thinkers, but regardless, what's going on in these western plains states? Is it as bad as it looks?
Do you personally know some sweet old church ladies who 'hate the gays because they'll going to hell' or are there just more extreme law makers being elected that don't represent the majority?
EDIT: tried to fix link to a conversation instead of a login page.
In Iowa, the governor is strangely borderline. She is very accepting and even encouraging of immigrant migration to Iowa, but believes there is an illegal immigration crisis. She believes in increasing both STEM education and Social Emotional Learning in schools, but also has put it into law that a teacher who finds out a student as part of the LGBTQ+ community (or even asks to use a name that’s not in their cumulative file) MUST tell the parents. She’s repeatedly refused federal aid for school food programs and social services. She’s highly against medical marijuana except for the most extreme cases (not eve glaucoma) - to the extent of vetoing a law passed by the legislature to expand it to more cases - even as every state around us goes full recreational. She’s restricted abortion significantly. We have a surplus budget but our roads are shit. We have a banned books list, but it’s not as extreme as other states.
At the local level, things are different depending on where you live. My school district is great, very inclusive and accepting. There are many LGBTQ+ kids, open and still somewhat closeted, but not much pushback about it.
@[email protected] @[email protected] How is the general population?
In the midwest, we are called the Bible belt. We are also accused of being the biggest bigots, with terms like neo Christianity or religio-fascists. I like to think/pretend that law makers are a little more extreme or loud than the general population, but they still pander to a base that elects them, so that negates my idea to some extent. Maybe the process of legislating looses nuance and empathy because it's difficult to do that in law? I'm not sure. Maybe I have an unrealistically rosy view of the region. I'm not in a group that would feel oppression or hatred for who I am unless I go to places with people who do, then I get labeled or target by those because I look like their oppressors (which is ironic, but understandable).
Indiana had the religious freedom act, which was a huge black eye. I could write a huge rant on cake lady. The short version is my refusal to accept her ideas as Christian/religion based, not mine anyway. IMO, Jesus never treated anyone like shit other than the Pharisees, whom he constantly schooled for 'missing the point'. I think she was just a plain old fashion bigot, and I wish she would have just said "I don't like gay people". I wouldn't have to agree, but at least she'd be honest and take the proper heat for it.
Unfortunately, I know there's plenty of criticism for the Midwest, conservative region that probably has some roots in religion, but I'm not sure if it's just because of religion or the negative manipulation of it. Example: Islam is inherently bad and violent, or it was corrupted to manipulate people to violence and hate?
I'm in one of the marginalized groups, being gay and married to a first-gen immigrant who also has trans people in my family and neighbors , family, friends who don't speak English and/or are non-Christian (Muslims, atheists).
It's not like everyone here is bad, but the people who elect these bigots know exactly what they stand for, and they support it.
Also, South Dakota has a really problematic history, so it's not like all of this has just come out of left field.
And I know not all religious people are hateful, so I try not to characterize them that way. One of the first people I felt comfortable coming out to was a Muslim woman, and we (my husband and I) literally are friends with some clergy who happen to be some of the most outspoken LGBTQIA+ allies in our community imo.
But anyone who supports Republicans here knows exactly what they're getting, and as I've said in many cases wish people like Noem would go even further to marginalize and oppress these marginalized groups. In fact, I used to try to befriend Republicans, but in every case they ended up disclosing to me some extremely fucked up goals, and I can't legitimize their worldview by having anything to do with them beyond what my work requires.
You're a double or triple then...:)
Do you think that is a majority, or just a powerful/extreme small group?
I don't know anything about SD, so I'll have to google what you're talking about.
I can relate to this in a small way. I'm probably way more conservative then most average/stereotype lemmy users, but I find that the view points of people I work with are far more extreme/right than mine. I'm maybe barely right, or right in some things, and left in others? Who cares. I just cannot for the life of me see how they can only view things/people from one side. When they rant about left/D things, I point out the same things about right/R things, it's like they lose their minds. It's all fake news and brainwashing, but they don't see the hypocrisy in anyway. I have no idea how.
I am still hoping the whole region isn't as bad as I'm led to believe. That's the reason some of your view points are helpful.
Well I mean, it's not all bad. We've got the tribal governments, we've got a still not insignificant number of people who aren't members of extremist hate groups such as the Republicans. Some of us just live here because we somehow found ourselves here and lack the resources to relocate easily. I personally fear when people write us off as all bad when there are plenty of us working to make positive change. I know so many people on the res who aren't in positions to move states, and I know there's also a concerted effort from the right to block Native votes. There are a lot of good people here. In fact, I sometimes can forget I'm surrounded by bigots because my own social circles aren't like that at all.
Are all Republicans the 'same' I your opinion?
I often want to think that people can be conservative and like some Republican ideas, but without the stereotypical bigotry stuff.
Personally now, I think that's less and less possible, but part of why I'm asking.
I feel like I'm running into less barely Republican people, and more very Republican people. I guess by that, I mean people whom are more accepting or believing that their policies are right (being very opposed to immigration, accepting LGBTQ, pro corporate, etc).
I like the Midwest, and dislike the East Coast look and feel. I haven't been on the West Coast enough to form a meaningful opinion.
I also don't qualify for discrimination targeting. Most of the corruption I'm surrounded by seems to relate more to socioeconomics and greedy politicians than people who care about someone's color/etc, but again, maybe naive...
Pretty much, yeah. I didn't used to, but they've shown me time and time again that they are awful.
I don't think it's possible to be Republican without the stereotypical bigotry stuff. Even the "conservative economics" crowd -- when you look at it, those "conservative economic" policies they support have been designed specifically to harm and disenfranchise marginalized groups. For instance, "the Dakota Access Pipeline is good because it helps the economy" is objectively a bigoted opinion.
I mean, yeah. These people often believe their opinions and beliefs are helpful and just. They may believe that undocumented workers are really taking our jobs, or that we LGBTQIA+ people are pedos, or that privatization helps the poor -- but all of these things are so mustache-twirlingly atrocious that they don't get a pass for subscribing to beliefs that are causing so much widespread harm, even if they truly believe they are in the right.
I like the east coast because of the way their cities are designed. Visiting places like NYC or Philadelphia, I don't even miss not having my car. I used to live near the west coast, and that was the opposite. I know there are things like parks and public transportation in LA and OC, but maaaaan I still felt compelled to drive everywhere. There's natural beauty out there though, and I like their conservation areas. Personally, I'd live in Minneapolis, MN if I could. 10 minute walk from a park everywhere you go, and they keep extending the lightrail. I guess I kinda like the midwest. I don't like my state, though, because I can never fit in here, and it's like they specifically design our communities to be miserable. It could be a nice pretty place to live among nature, but it's not.
All that stuff is related, though. I don't trust anyone who says they're "just" an economic conservative because that's still harmful -- and this includes liberals, by the way. I don't trust anyone who defends these inherently inequitable systems. I'm extremely unhappy with both our major parties.
This is all my opinion though, and much of it is based on my repeated experiences. I had to leave my last job because I reported overt racism by people who were some of these "totally not racist but conservative" types. Didn't surprise me that it happened, because I'm old and I've seen this scenario play out time and time again with different people.
Thanks for the insight.
It's a shame we still can all just get along. That saying is lame, but it's ultimately the goal.
One of my ideas, that isn't terribly realistic or shouldn't have to be resorted to, is to locate our selves in regions that are more welcoming.
There was a person at my work who was lesbian, which I suspected, but they weren't open. One day at a social event, they brought their wife and brother (for support) and made public. I was stupid and didn't put all that together until then.
They moved to Washington State and both have great jobs now. I felt like part of that move was related to moving to a region known to support their life style more welcomingly, at least compared to Indiana.
You shouldn't have to do that, but if I could stack enough chips to afford doing that and needed to, I would.
I said above that you shouldn't have to do that ever. No one should be treated like shit by whole groups of people, political, religious or other wise.
I like the idea of states competing for talent and opportunity. Washington also tried decriminalization of all drugs. Lots of people nay sayed. I thought it was great. They tried an experiment instead of just listening to a bunch of wind bags. That didn't work as it was implemented, but we all got real world data, and identified other failures of legislation that went beyond just drugs (treatment, transportation issues, logistics, funding,.etc). I might be all talk though, I would not want to conduct that here.
Weed is the same way. All the states doing it are eventually going to have eliminated all excuses for now allowing it. Some states still might never. That's ok. People can shuffle around based on what's important to them.
You shouldn't ever have to be subjected to mistreatment just for who you are though, anywhere in America.
I hate both our parties, most of all politicians, and a large majority of our policies in their current form. There's no one for me to vote for, and no national pride in what they do or represent.