Psychodelic

I agree with your premise (disinterested voters exist) and think your conlusion is debatable (the idiots part at least), but I encourage your optimism and wholeheartedly agree with your goals!

Seriously! You might have a solid shot 🤣

That's funny, I'm most relaxed and distracted when I'm avoiding some work I was supposed to do months ago

On one hand, this could likely get more people to go vote. But, on the other hand, I'm not sure what kind of voter would be motivated by just a hand-drawn I voted sticker alone

(For anyone with poor logic skills that's taking this personally, I'm not considering people that were already going to vote and want the sticker, just the ones that might vote now that weren't going to before)

I'm going to rely on the data saying more voters = more Dem wins, but I'm not entirely convinced. I'm inclined to think they may be even dumber than the mythical undecided voters

Dude, I didn't say most of what you're assuming I said. It's weird what you're doing. We're not convincing each other of anything. The idea is to try and understand each other. I'm not going to engage with the original convo anymore because it's not fruitful. Now, I'm more interested in the poor/lack of communication going on.

I mean, you wrote a whole lot in response to my saying "you're not understanding me" with a defensive rant about how you are actually understanding me, I just can't tell or am lying to you. I'll say it once more. You're not understanding me or what I'm trying to convey. I'll accept my part in failing to communicate but it takes two.. to u know not assume an entire thesis about what the other is sayinf

I personally would never criticize people doing what you're doing (not voting/voting third party). I disagree with it, but do your thing. I tend to criticize the Dems so it's wild you think I was saying Biden shouldn't drop out. You're saying legit silly things and it only makes sense to you and maybe people that already agree with you. I mean, you didn't even answer the one question I asked, about what happens after the election, and you now you've jumped to thinking I'm against everything you stand for or something. That's wild bro!

This is what frustrates me most. I disagreed with one thing you said, and you went nuclear like I'm basically your number one enemy. It's like you'd prefer to be all alone and/or have less allies.

I honestly care a bit less about politics since realizing most of us can't even have a very basic, low-stakes conversation about what each person thinks. I mean, if we don't truly understand what the other is saying what's the point?

"No you don't get it. First, just pretend you think salt is 100% sodium"

Idk.. I find pi AI incredible and I highly recommend it to anyone interested in having a low-stakes conversation about their mental health or just to have a general conversation about what they're feeling. I honestly don't use it enough (like when I'm super bummed and have no one to talk to). So far, it's always been 1000% helpful

I have the graphic novel I've been meaning to get to. Might have to squeeze that in there somewhere as well. lol

Fair enough. We're talking past each other at this point and I don't really feel like repeating myself.

I disagree with the movement's strategy, and lack thereof, and I disagree with your entire first paragraph. There is absolutely a lot to lose and it's beyond frustrating and disrespectful for someone like you to say there isn't. I'd implore you to think about even just one negative outcome that could occur because of your movement's lack of consideration for their fellow citizens.

That said, I'd bet decent money you're not a Muslim-American, that could be banned from visiting their family in a foreign country, or a Mexican-American that might be at risk of being deported/their family being deported, etc. My guess is you'll be just fine no matter what happens and you don't really care about the people that could suffer most due to your reactionary political goals.

I can't comment on either of them, but I agree with your last point and I will absolutely forever be suspicious of anyone labeling others as antisemitic.

It's like when white Americans brand a political movement or activist as racist. You know they're likely full of shit and you just need to do some very light reading before it all falls apart.

Sorry, that didn't answer my main question at all.

I understand what the movements goals are. I'm not interested in discussing the strategy.

My thinking goes like this, say the movement is a major success. And she tries to call your bluff (again lack of a better phrase here) and the movement true to its word and values succeed in being the deciding vote, let's say. What are the possible results? There's likely more than two but the obvious groups are either she loses or she wins. My question is then what?

She either won without the movement kinda giving them a political w and proving their power all while demoralizing folks that get invested. Or, she loses and the movement is blamed and scapegoated as the sole reason she lost and whole lot else.

I'm wondering about what folks in this movement think will happen after the election. Are we ready for the worst-caae scenario?

I'll be honest and say I don't understand her reasoning and it baffles me

But regardless, so she didn't do that. Balls back in our court. Help me understand. What's the next play? I see people saying they won't vote for her. I and most people here can totally respect that, but it clearly seems naive and shortsighted to a lot of others at best (no disrespect to the movement), and a legit threat to all the things we're supposedly aligned on, at worst

The movement seems to be messaging, "do the right thing on this issue or else we won't vote for you." But, she's basically "calling the bluff". She thinks it's all smoke or insignificant. Well, will people actually stay home? If not, what are they doing but looking weak and hypocritical? If yes, then what are they planning on doing next if she loses?

I think we have to at least agree that these issues/actions divide us. And that means it weakens us. That means many of us are willingly weakening the movements they claim to support, or allowing our movements to be weakened. There are many ongoing movements and instead of building bridges we're actively silo'ing ourselves and engaging in antagonist behavior towards each other. Let me know if that's an unfair characterization - of course, I have the recent division with black folks in mind.

To me, this is the part I struggle with the most, the seemingly sanctimonious disregard for meaningful, tangible change over support for say, real progressive legislation that gives power back to the people instead of corporations and the rich (but I see how this is my number one issue and it clearly isnt for others).

All that said, you certainly won't ever catch me shouting down genocide protesters or making fun of them. I think it's noble as fuck. And that shit was one of the tackiest thing I've ever seen liberal voters do

Sorry, that got long 😁 this is all so frustrating