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[–] 205 points 3 years ago (31 children)

I'm in Europe, and work for an American company. After a few issues in production, they tried to implement an on-call requirement for employees to check the alerts during their out of work hours (5am to 10pm or something stupid like that). I just reminded them that my country has the "Right to disconnect" law, which protects us from having to work outside our required hours.

They changed it to volunteer basis. I refuse to volunteer (because my off time is my time).

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  • [–] 60 points 3 years ago (9 children)

    When I was younger, I also though I'd be cool to work in America, but once you learn a bit about their conditions, it's a big nope. Much better lifestyle in small cities with an average salary in EU and the 23 days vacation + 13 - 14 bank holidays. Mental health checks out. 😄

    About the Prod on calls, even if you "volunteer", depending on the country and kind of job, they have to paid those "on call" hours even if there's no calls at the end, and if there's work required, the pay is higher.

    I'm like you, I wouldn't exchange my free time no matter what. 🤘

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  • [–] 30 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    Years ago now I was asked to be on call for a week, 24/7 outside working hours. I was told it would be paid. Being naive I thought I'd be paid at my normal rate.

    Turns out the on call rate was based on the likelihood of being called and this project was deemed to be low, after tax I got less than £10 extra for the whole week. It was something like 14 pence an hour.

    They had a whole load of restrictions on my life as well, couldn't be more than an hour from the office, couldn't be drunk, had to answer the phone within a minute at all times and be able to get on my laptop within 5 minutes.

    Refused to do it again after that first week and they ended up having to pay a contractor £400/week instead.

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  • [–] 20 points 3 years ago*

    Were you in the UK? if so they robbed you. They need to pay at least minimum wage in the UK even for on call. You are also allowed rest breaks. What they did was unbelievably criminal. Hell if that overtime included times where you were asleep and you were still on call they still need to pay you the National minimum wage for those hours as well.

    Only part that wasn't illegal is the extra restrictions, as you are still working so you can't exactly treat it as a day off.

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  • [–] 16 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    I also wanted to go to the US to work. When I was done studying, and had a degree. Moving to NYC to work was a life goal until I researched the working conditions. Fuck that.

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  • [–] 49 points 3 years ago (3 children)

    A few years back, a company where a friend of mine worked was bought up by an american company. I do not know why they didn't do their research beforehand, but the new american owners announced they would be expecting the newly bought company to adopt an american work culture. Almost everyone quit. My friend is a programmer. He got a new job offer almost before he was out of the door.

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  • [–] 41 points 3 years ago (5 children)

    It's amazing that I work for a large European company in America and am forced to accept calls or come into the plant 24/7.

    It's almost like it has to come from a government to make corporations behave.

    I have colleagues that have their out of offices set to "I'll be available by cell or email" or somesuch. Mine doesn't say anything, and I don't check it unless I want to. My vacation time is MY time.

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  • [–] 15 points 3 years ago (6 children)

    Was there any extra compensation offered for the added duty?

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  • [–] 17 points 3 years ago

    No, or at least not initially.

    When I brought up the "Right to disconnect", I also asked about overtime. They said it won't be compensated, but they'll think about it in the future.

    Regardless, unless its really well compensated, I don't plan on doing it. I'm not really pressed for money, so I value free time over money.

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    [–] 84 points 3 years ago (10 children)
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    [–] 79 points 3 years ago (6 children)

    Man, a lot of you Americans need to unionize. None of this happens at my work and it's precisely because we're unionized and have a contract that specifically says that our employer is bound by strict rules. Granted, we don't get a month paid vacation, but we can't be denied time off, can't be compelled to be on call, can't be forced to work overtime and we have PTO accounts, healthcare and a pension that get paid into on a weekly basis.

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  • [–] 46 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    "but we get paid so much more" /s. I've heard this before from people in the tech sector, ignoring the fact that should the shit hit the fan we Americans have no social programs to assist us. I'd take half my pay to get what people in Europe are guaranteed.

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  • [–] 23 points 3 years ago* (2 children)

    We try and then it's taken over by corrupt lazy union bosses that don't actually help or the company just fires you under an at will employment lie and hires scabs. The government has essentially been infiltrated by corporate American to pass legislation allowing them to break unions easier. Lobbying is our problem, not the lack of unions atm.

    Over half of Congress would be indicted on corruption if we really gave a shit about threats to our society like the current political theatre claims.

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    [–] 67 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    This was my father in-law. He developed sepsis from the foot they had to keep doing surgery on. On his hospital bed where he is hooked up to just about every machine possible, this man was on his laptop doing work and on a cell phone talking to this engineer and that engineer. After his foot was amputated, even on disability he was being called 24/7. He was the most important person in the region, he memorized every fiber optic line and location. His boss was treating him like shit to get him to quit, he didn't like dad for some reason, so he pushed dad constantly and shamefully. Once dad died, they had the nerve to call us asking if he had any documents that could help them with a project, he was doing the job of 4-5 college graduates and they were barely managing. He only had his high school degree but the man knew his shit. He had an interview lined up at a new higher paying job, he was one week away, and he spent the last few months of his life crying from stress, hating his job, and just in near constant despair, the only thing that he was looking forward to was mine and my wife's wedding. Corporate America is a vampire and not the sexy kind, the nosferatu kind.

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  • [–] 58 points 3 years ago (3 children)

    In some countries, Summer is something you have - not just the name of a season you can see from your office window.

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    [–] 55 points 3 years ago

    England: We had a really good deal going but we can't have that because we are committed to racism. We hereby leave the European union without doing any research at all as to the secondary effects of our decisions.

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  • [–] 52 points 3 years ago (3 children)

    I live and work in Japan, but I'm still in this picture and I hate it... Though my work-life balance has progressively gotten better. I don't, however, let my subordinates do that; I want them to have real time off. If they answer a slack or something, it's helpful, but I'd rather they didn't think about work in their off time. I try to be the leader I wished for.

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  • [+] 50 points 3 years ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)
  • [–] 41 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    My boss is having his wedding tomorrow. He was supposed to start his vacation earlier this week. He definitely showed up to meetings I GUARANTEE he didn't need to be in on the first day he was supposed to be gone. Man, we've been here longer than you. We can handle it. You're awesome, but don't let upper management bully you. Us senior devs sure don't. Fuck em.

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  • [–] 14 points 3 years ago

    That's crazy to me. Our manager went out on a boat last week on Friday, and we haven't heard shit from him since. Hell, we'd probably tattle on him to our skip level if we did because our skip would be furious to hear people are working during vacation. I'm a software engineer in the US, and unfortunately stories like yours are all too common here :/

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    [–] 47 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    I have quit jobs to go on vacation

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    [–] 42 points 3 years ago* (4 children)

    So unrealistic... No way the guy on the bottom got the time off to go to surgery.

    Imagine how mad my former boss was when I was in the hospital for 4 days because the heart issues I didn't know about were causing me to nearly pass out at work. Then I got a note that let me off for 3 weeks to let the new meds take effect before I went back.

    Don't get me started on how half ass the diagnosis ended up being either. Got a heart transplant 5 years later after seeing a different doctor.

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    [–] 34 points 3 years ago* (5 children)

    I used to be the second guy, and then realized the system I was working in. America can fuck itself (and it is), I'm off to Europe later this year.

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  • [–] 26 points 3 years ago (20 children)

    I'm an American with unlimited time off. Took 3 weeks to travel after 4 months at the company. Not every company operating here is a POS.

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  • [–] 16 points 3 years ago

    We did a year of unlimited time off. I took 2x1-week and 1x2 week and a few days here and there.

    At the end of the year they announced no time off except Christmas and Thanksgiving days during Nov thru Jan and you can't take more than a week off at the time.

    They couple this with a company wide raise but if they don't change the policy after the moratorium ends in January I think I'd rather earn less and have more time off.

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    [–] 26 points 3 years ago (16 children)

    it's not just europe, I live in Latin America we have 3+ weeks of payed time off, the us job market is the weirdo

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    [+] 20 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (5 children)
  • [–] 27 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    A one man fight is essentially banishment. Too many of our countrymen are brainwashed to believe that working yourself to death is a point of pride, and here we are. Many of us want better for ourselves and especially our kids, but bootlickers keep us all in shit city.

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  • [–] 16 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Not only that, the powers that are in control of the country have intentionally limited our ability to collectivize, they have reduced our wages as much as they can to keep us desperate, they have reduced our time off to keep us tired. They do not want us to fight and they have structured it such that we won’t until we are all entirely broken.

    Work from home is an issue because we realized we can have lives again, and maybe we could even work less!

    But then we have more time to focus on things that matter, like protesting and unionizing.

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