GucciMane comments on This is literally me I do this

This is literally me I do this (hexbear.net)

submitted 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) by autismdragon@hexbear.net to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net

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[–] GucciMane@hexbear.net 28 points 2 years ago (101 children)

You're seeing the opinions of the western left, and in our countries our movements have only just been rebounding after decades of very harsh repression and propaganda, so it'll take more time, struggle, and political development for people to see the difference between social democracy and revolutionary society. It is unfortunate, but for now, many will be captivated by the former.

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[–] CatratchoPalestino@hexbear.net 22 points 2 years ago* (100 children)

yours is not the only one captivated. mine and many across latin america are so captivated we actually elect these people to power lol. it’s fine anyway since I selfishly want the government in iran to remain in power long enough to kill israel you can selfishly want the anti-american governments to stay in power to oppose your country. also honduras is a western country too lmao

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[–] autismdragon@hexbear.net [S] 24 points 2 years ago (26 children)

you can selfishly want the anti-american governments to stay in power to oppose your country. also honduras is a western country too lmao

Yes this is exactly the point being made here. Its not even selfish. Its just how Lenininst antiimperalism works. Wanting American hegenomy to be hurt as an American is actually the opposite of selfish?

Also for the last line, yes its in the western hemisphere but its not part of the imperial core. Which is why we carefully use that language instead. The tem "western" is fairly useless for this reason.

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[–] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 17 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (36 children)

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but no Latin American nations are included in “the collective west” which is purely white and rich nations. They don’t allow you in the club. Americans and Europeans don’t consider south or Central America white despite how white the local comprador classes consider themselves

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[+] ElHexo@hexbear.net 15 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (35 children)

[deleted]

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[–] CatratchoPalestino@hexbear.net 12 points 2 years ago (34 children)

it’s a majority protestant country that speaks spanish. you think it has more in common with east asia or muslim countries or something?

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[+] ElHexo@hexbear.net 21 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (6 children)

[deleted]

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[–] CatratchoPalestino@hexbear.net 12 points 2 years ago (2 children)

the phillipines speaks over 100 malayo-polynessian languages and zambia speaks a similar number of bantu languages. neither of them speak english as a primary language nor do they have the same connection to the west that latin america does

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[–] sooper_dooper_roofer@hexbear.net 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

The "West" is an overwhelmingly racist concept that produces bizarre things like the categorisation of countries in South America as not being western despite for example Uruguay or Argentina having a majority of people with predominantly European ancestors

a ton of Black Americans also have predominantly European ancestors, I guess racism is solved since they're all "western" right?

You can cope or bloviate all you want about this stuff, but real white people know the score and are playing the game. If you're pale with at least brown hair and have an American accent then sure, you pass regardless of what your ancestry is

The "West" is and HAS to be a racial concept, because if it weren't basically half if not the majority of the world could be considered Western and the term would just be meaningless. The racial concept is also in accordance with how westerners (actual ones) act.

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[–] Frogmanfromlake@hexbear.net 16 points 2 years ago (17 children)

I agree with you as a Guatemalan. I've always considered our countries part of the West and think it's a little patronizing how richer Western nations don't consider us Western. The diaspora like to push this idea that we're majority indigenous and that indigenous cultures are more prevalent than they actually are.

We're kind of like the Balkans. They go on and off as to whether or not we're included as Western or not.

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[–] sooper_dooper_roofer@hexbear.net 16 points 2 years ago (9 children)

I've always considered our countries part of the West and think it's a little patronizing how richer Western nations don't consider us Western

Don't you think that if your people are treated as second-class citizens in core Western countries, that you might actually NOT be Western in the eyes of anyone who actually cares about these terms?

Like, why can't you take the hint? Or have you really not figured it out yet?

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[–] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 9 points 2 years ago

I've always considered our countries part of the West and think it's a little patronizing how richer Western nations don't consider us Western.

They don’t consider you part of their racist white supremacist club, that’s a fact. Why do you want to be in it so bad and consider it offensive when they don’t include you? It should be an honor to be separate from the West, the West TM is fascist scum

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[–] CatratchoPalestino@hexbear.net 9 points 2 years ago (5 children)

I'm palestinian honduran so I wouldn't even bother trying to argue with the few people I'd run into that seriously consider race what makes someone western. I still don't see why it matters so much to american leftists tho. is bashing on the west too awkward for them if you include poorer countries in the americas and balkans? I don't get the point in bashing anyway I'm not gonna feel guilty for being born in the west

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[–] voight@hexbear.net 20 points 2 years ago (1 child)

Leftists have already figured out the difference between these regions, if you're curious. The Balkans are peripheral Europe. https://hexbear.net/post/1385667

Western can be a misnomer like global south. Half the time when I say NATO I'm mentally including Japan and Australia and occupied Korea. Japan and occupied Korea are pretty damn Western now depending on how you mean that.

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[–] sooper_dooper_roofer@hexbear.net 15 points 2 years ago* (2 children)

I'm palestinian honduran so I wouldn't even bother trying to argue with the few people I'd run into that seriously consider race what makes someone western.

those "few people", aka the entirety of the population who actually cares about this shit lmao. Including the cunning ones who pretend to consider you guys "western" just for optics, and then support every standard right-wing American position

Nobody considers Christian, Portugese-speaking Angola to be "Western". Race is literally half the criteria.

I still don't see why it matters so much to american leftists tho

uhhh...because it matters to american rightists? If you spent a few months in America in a rural area with an Islamic name I think you'd learn pretty quick

"Western" = politically western European, and white

Russia isn't politically western so they don't fit
Poland used to not be western, but now is
Parts of the Balkans are part of the west (certainly not in the core though)
Japan and Korea are rich and vassal states of NATO, but are not white
America is technically mixed race, but the average white American is 98.5% white (and western european to boot), unlike any "white" person in any Latin country where even the least mixed people are still 20% Native admixed

Nothing in Latin America is Western in any sense other than cardinal directions. Yes, you're all Christian and part Spanish/Portu, but any "camaraderie" you see there is a completely one-way street--the people in Europe do NOT feel that way mutually about you, even if they don't get as violent about it as in the US. You could MAYBE make an exception for Argentina and Uruguay because it seems a lot of them (still not all) are close enough on racial criteria to "pass" visually. Places like Mexico and Colombia will never be western, because you can't be part of a group if your people get hatecrimed on sight (with no repercussions) in said countries .

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[–] sooper_dooper_roofer@hexbear.net 10 points 2 years ago* (7 children)

No, I think Latin America has more in common with itself. Tons of countries in Asia and Africa (basically every country) has significant and sometimes complete fluency in a European language, and are Christian, but not considered Western.

Not to mention that many Latin American countries and subregions have huge cultural influences from regional Native American cultures and enslaved Africans

Latin America has never received economic benefits from the Western umbrella in the way that the EU states have. And they probably never will, and their racial origin is the most major reason for this. They are not Western.

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[–] TheDialectic@hexbear.net 10 points 2 years ago

According to US policy more like the middle east yeah.

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