this post was submitted on 02 Nov 2023
138 points (98.6% liked)

Canada

7185 readers
315 users here now

What's going on Canada?

Communities

🍁 Meta

🗺️ Provinces / Territories

🏙️ Cities / Local Communities

🏒 SportsHockey

Football (NFL)

  • List of All Teams: unknown

Football (CFL)

  • List of All Teams: unknown

Baseball

Basketball

Soccer

💻 Universities

💵 Finance / Shopping

🗣️ Politics

🍁 Social and Culture

Rules

Reminder that the rules for lemmy.ca also apply here. See the sidebar on the homepage:

https://lemmy.ca

founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
[email protected]
138
Basic income 'unlocked dozens of doors for me,' supporter says amid call for national program | CBC News (www.cbc.ca)
submitted 1 year ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
18 comments fedilink hide all child comments
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And when governments ignore the economic needs of everyone except the rich for too long, the result tends to be violence

Only at extremes far beyond of what we are seeing today. Other places in the world have substantially larger Gini coefficients and that hasn't translated into violence.

The US is perilously close to that now, and we’re not doing much better

What basis do you have to assert that?

D’you really want a revolution, with all the blood-in-the-streets nastiness that entails?

A false dichotomy.

We need to change the game somehow, and UBI is one way of doing it. Not the only way, granted, but the political will doesn’t seem to be there for any of the others either

You are assuming that a UBI would be beneficial to the working class. I have presented multiple reasons why that is questionable, and you haven't addressed any one of them.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

That's because your individual points all derive from focusing on the wrong things.

What people want is prosperity—the sense of flourishing and being successful at life. Unfortunately, that's very difficult to measure, because definitions of "success" are idiosyncratic and widely variable. So we measure money as a proxy for prosperity. The problem is, it's a very bad proxy, one that can actually pull in the opposite direction of the thing it's supposed to be a proxy for. Which is what appears to be happening here.

You're trying to look at this from the point of view of macroeconomics, which is the study of large-scale money flows. Money flows. Except that programs like UBI are not designed to optimise money flows, they're an attempt to improve median prosperity, even if that results in poorer mean financial outcomes.

I admit my previous post was a bit on the hyperbolic side, but you're treating this as though the situation were a case study in an economics class. Which it isn't.