Seeing Blackbird fly again after all these years would be incredible. I'd love to know what NASA has planned for it.

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[–] 36 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (21 children)

I like its lines, but realistically, I don't know what you'd use it for unless you need extremely high-resolution images.

We know, from Trump's probably-ill-advised tweet back in 2019, that we can do 10-centimeter resolution from reconaissance satellites like USA-224, near the physical limitations of light resolution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA-224

Perigee altitude: 270 kilometers (170 mi)[1]
Apogee altitude: 986 kilometers (613 mi)[1]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird

During missions, the SR-71 operated at high speeds and altitudes (Mach 3.2 at 85,000 ft or 26,000 m)

The SR-71 operates at a tenth to a thirtieth USA-224's altitude, so assuming comparable imaging systems (which I could believe) and that there aren't stability or thermal issues (which I'd be less-certain of) it can get ten to thirty times the resolution of a KH11 satellite from the lower altitude. I'm not sure how much utility there is in reconnaissance to getting 1 cm or ⅓ cm resolution images instead of 10 cm.

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  • [–] 18 points 1 day ago (10 children)

    I can think of a couple of reasons to use the SR-71 again.

    • Concern that a crash in space could lead to a cascade of crashes, disabling all sattellites.
    • (On demand) capacity. I could imagine that the SR-71 can cover an unplanned spot faster than sattellites. Also, with the wars in Ukraine and Iran they're maybe finding out that they don't have enough imaging capacity.
    • The imaging angle, a plane can image almost horizontally, they can look under bridges, through windows etc.
    • A ten times increased resolution could be useful for recognizing details, maybe it's even good enough to recognize people though it might be pushing the limits of facial recognition. It's also the kind of resolution where they can read some text, e.g. identifyers on shipping containers or military vehicles.
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  • [–] 17 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (5 children)

    the sr-71 is definitely not a scramble-able plane:

    • it leaks fuel when on the ground (it shrinks when cold) so it's stored empty,
    • it's as aerodynamic as a brick when subsonic so it needs an insanely long runway, and
    • it has an always-on afterburner so it burns an alarming amount of fuel.

    when they were doing surveys of iraq during desert storm they had to field a fleet of eight tanker planes over the indian ocean just so the damn thing would make it from japan to the gulf.

    Edit: oh and those are specially designed tanker planes because of course it uses JP-7 so they needed separate tanks for that and their own fuel. they also needed to be able to refuel at like 850km/h or the blackbird would just drop out of the sky.

    love that plane.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

    Iirc it starts nearly empty and is only fueled up in the air, so basically no way around tanker planes.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    that's apparently not true, it would take off with half fuel because the landing gear could buckle under the full weight.

    even with a full tank it could only go for about 90 minutes though so anything nontrivial did indeed require a tanker.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 day ago (3 children)

    Can't they do all that with drones?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

    You need to deliver the drones to the location of interest though. And regularly bring fresh ones I guess. A stealthy and fast as fuck delivery platform would make sense.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 day ago* (2 children)

    realistically, I don't know what you'd use it for unless you need extremely high-resolution images.

    Well, what does NASA do?

    I think it's a pretty safe bet that NASA wants it to test something about aerodynamics at extremely high speeds. Perhaps they want it to deploy some experiment at mach 3. Sometimes you just don't know if your simulation models are correct, and you need to try something in the real world.

    I suppose it's also possible they want it to get some close up footage of a rocket during launch or reentry.

    But I think the most likely answer is still that they just need something that goes very fast.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    The thing is sounding rockets do exactly that and are still in service (vs somehow unfucking an ancient plane that hasn't been serviced in decades with tooling that no longer exists) and there are multiple companies out there operating supersonic drones for high speed tests of whatever you wanna do.

    I dont see the value in bringing the blackbird back into service. I think its more likely that they want to freshen up the paint and park it at some press conference / event.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 hours ago*

    Well, you can control your airspeed and attitude in an airplane, solid rockets just make a ballistic arch and they only accelerate, they can't maintain a speed.

    So if you want to test how air behaves in a particular regime, you can't actually maintain that regime with a sounding rocket, so the best you can get is a snapshot.

    Honestly, if what they're working on is dialing-in their computer models, the more precise data they can get, the better. It makes sense to maintain a speed for a minute, so you can get a really good running average on your measurements of air pressure, heating, drag, etc. They may want to conduct the same tests at different altitudes and airspeeds, and probably all in level flight. To control all those factors, that's near impossible to do with a rocket.

    Again, I don't know what they're doing, what their actual plans are. I'm just saying there are absolutely plausible reasons to use this aircraft.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    Satellites are too predictable, plus too infrequent. If there are two spy satellites that cover Iran, for example, Iran can easily know when and what direction, then presumably take some effort to cover whatever they want to hide.

    A reconnaissance plane can show up without warning, any time, loiter for at least minutes, take pictures from different angles, in addition to sharper imaging. We can speculate they may also have sharper non-optical imaging, such as thermal or radar

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  • [–] 2 points 8 hours ago

    Ok, but what if there are several satellites that cover iran at all times? What if they would need to hide from most directions all of the time? Because I think that's basically the situation right now. The whole world is being monitored from multiple angles all of the time by several different governments. At that point, reconnaissance aircraft in general seem a little redundant.

    I think the only real utility they offer is the ability to swap out sensors between flights and upgrade old cameras to the new cutting edge options whenever they're available.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago

    My money's on hegseth wants the sonic booms when he's giving a speech about how manly the army is. Considering they have that unmanned x-37B for spy satellite stuff, and it would be a massive amount of money to bring back the blackbird, while NASA is having its budget cut, it is 100% going to be for some self serving promotion.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

    I would just like to point out that while not confirmed, it has been speculated since the mid-2000s that the actual imaging resolution of the satellites is closer to 2mm. Or as the joke goes, we'll figure out what brand of cigarettes you smoke by reading the filter.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    I would say that that's purely speculation. Physics won't allow it. The diffraction limit basically limits the best resolution to about 10 cm (assuming an altitude of 200 km, blue light and a humongously large lens with a diameter of 1 m). It's likely that they're quite close to the diffraction limit and maybe they have even more extreme hardware than I would guess, but a two orders of magnitude better resolution isn't happening anytime soon I think.

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