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[–] 2 points 2 days ago (6 children)

You're confusing a collectively decided role with bourgeoisie lapdogs. The meme specifies middle management, not coordinators, longer term planners, etc.. Not all work requires management, and not certainly bourgeoisie protectors.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago* (5 children)

    Middle management is explicitly not the task masters that supervise workers and police their behavior and explicitly not the c-suite of do-nothing bourgeoisie soothsayers. It's quite explicitly the group of people that analyze the organization, improve safety and training, handle worker complaints, plan things, evaluate decisions that impact the collective, etc.

    Middle management absolutely includes coordinator functions, planning functions, etc.

    I'm not confusing a collectively decided role with bourgeoisie lapdogs, I am saying that the work that middle.managemrnt does in bourgeois corporations includes much of the same work that would be needed in a large-scale workers cooperative.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (4 children)

    I’m not confusing a collectively decided role with bourgeoisie lapdogs, I am saying that the work that middle.managemrnt does in bourgeois corporations includes much of the same work that would be needed in a large-scale workers cooperative.

    If this was true, the bourgeoisie would have ceased from existing, as “large-scale organizers” would have already toppled oppressive c-suites and private firms. It is precisely the fact bourgeoisie authorized management the powers to impose sanctions, demotions, pay cuts, worsen hours, worsen conditions, and harass, why the bourgeoisie hold any power. They are the supervisors, the internal police, the “soothsayers.”

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago (3 children)

    No, that doesn't make any sense. There's no way that a procurement manager or a sales VP would have sufficient power or safety to topple the bourgeoisie. That's a ridiculous sentiment. As we all know, the workers could just topple the bourgeoisie too and they haven't, does that make them lapdogs and class traitors?

    Middle management are not the supervisors, by definition. Supervisors of front line staff are excluded from the definition of middle management. Without supervising workers, middle management cannot be "the police" because they are not interacting with front line staff directly and cannot monitor them. Middle management primarily works with abstract collections of information, generally responding to price signals, and provide the information management tasks required for organizations to make decisions.

    And they are not bourgeois soothsayers because middle management doesn't talk to investors, bankers, creditors, and politicians. That's upper management and explicitly excluded from middle management.

    So no, middle management are not police and are not soothsayers. They are well paid members of the working class who are given a larger cut of the surplus in exchange for operating the bureaucracy of capitalism instead of the machine rooms of capitalism. They can be as much class traitors as individual laborers can be class traitors. But the role/work in and of itself isn't inherently class betrayal.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago (2 children)

    Apparently both literature, the meme, and reality conflict with your definition of the police of the bourgeoisie. Until the bourgeois police empower the proletariat, we have nothing further engage in.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago (1 child)

    Ah yes, anarchist literature. I had a feeling someone like Malatesta would make an appearance in your argument sooner or later

    Have fun with your moral crusade wherein you are the template for the hero and everyone else is your enemy. I am sure that will build class consciousness, revolutionary potential, and sustainable transformation.

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