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submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) by naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com to c/leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com

Maybe if people with your ideology only make things that harm you it's an opportunity to reflect.

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[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 1 points 9 hours ago

No leftists [...] even the cpc considers china communist. They claim to be attempting to realise communism by first

tl;dr of my response: China ain't Socialist, and shouldn't be emulated in our struggle for socialist revolution worldwide.

Many leftists don't consider China and the CPC to even be socialist, many socialists around the world see the CPC as a ruling class of another capitalist country, albeit with much higher rates of nationalised industries.

We think you can't really call yourself socialist when the workers don't have meaningful democratic control over society. And unless you're being dishonest or are just misinformed, the workers most certainly don't have control of society in China. Less so then here (Australia), even.

One only need to talk to people in China to realise this, most people I've spoken to in China, even though who support the government, describe a very hierarchical benevolent government.

One simply can't look a lefty in the eye and say China is socialist, unless those "Chinese Characteristics" suffixed to "Socialism" simply stand for "without democracy".

There is no meaningful method to agitate for political change (no, being in one of the other parties most certainly doesn't count), there are no workers unions (strikes are heavily repressed and the only union that exists is controlled by the CPC, though despite that some groups of workers still sometimes bravely strike 💪) no freedom of political association, no democracy in the workplace.

It's really hard to claim China is socialist, yet people outside of China still do, just because they're holding the banner of socialism...

I don't hate China, it's a pretty nice place, with lovely people, and certainly a nicer place than the shithole of the US. I've been to China multiple times, and you wouldn't catch me dead in the US.

But they just ain't Socialist, and shouldn't be emulated in our struggle for revolution worldwide.

[-] naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 5 hours ago

I think that's a bit reductive. While I am a sceptic that they'll ever really succeed and think they've fucked themselves a bit with how much power Chinese tech companies have been allowed to amass, there are true believers among the party and the central committee. I mean they teach Marxism in school (sort of).

In general chinese people describe extremely high satisfaction with their government, and respond more positively to questions like "If I have an issue I can go to my local politician and resolve it"^[https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/07/long-term-survey-reveals-chinese-government-satisfaction/] than Westminster derived systems (which I would also not dignify with the word democracy) and it is worth asking why this holds while most so called democracies have hostile and parasitic governments.

If the will of the people is enacted then this is a sort of democracy, while if you vote and then the people you elect serve elites and ignore you this isn't really democratic.

Structurally some things in China are working vastly better than elsewhere, and it's worth trying to understand /why/ their government seems to work for the people so much more than other systems.

But I was merely relaying what they claim about themselves to point out even people fully committed to toeing their party line would not call them communist.

this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2026
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