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Dbzero has Defederated from Feddit.org following its Governance post about the later's "Zionist Bar Problem" (lemmy.zip)

submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) by Salamence@lemmy.zip to c/fediverse@lemmy.world

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Dbzero Governance Vote Post https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/63525728

Ahoy mateys!

A few of our users have recently pointed out that a lot of the pro-Zionist accounts on the fediverse nowadays seem to come from the feddit.org instance.

But whatever the excuse happens to be, they need to do better imo. Israel is currently the most violent, fascist and genocidal nation state in the Middle East (if you exclude the US military bases there). And yet feddit.org seems to regard the Palestinians fighting against Israel’s ongoing illegal occupation of their land as the real terrorists. ....

More context

Our instance already voted to ban pro-Zionist accounts (see https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/60585441 for reference) and the rule that was implemented is here: Golden Rule #8.

As further context, you can find relevant comments and discussion in this post by a banned feddit admin in MoG (that fact they chose to post in MoG is in itself quite telling), and this post about their defederation from quokk.au over anti-semitism allegations has recently become active again. ...

Note 2: If you think feddit.org deserves a full instance ban instead, or have alternative suggestions, then please leave your comments below. If enough people think that’s the better option, then we’ll do that instead.

In the end the Post had around 70% of support by dbzer0 users, who in the comments also called for defederation.

Here is a Link to Dbzer0 instances tab https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/instances where if you go to blocked instances you can see fedddit.org is now defederated

i dont think feddit has made a post now, but when they do i will add it

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[-] Pamasich@kbin.earth -1 points 2 days ago

You're really not arguing in good faith, are you? Not supporting hamas doesn't mean I'm not in favor of resistance against genocide.

But just to clear this up once more:

I am against genocide
I support resistance against genocide
I still hold resistance groups to certain minimal standards
Hamas does not fulfill my standards

So no, I do not support Hamas. But yes, I do support Palestinian resistance in theory.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

"I don't oppose resistance against genocide, I just coincidentally oppose all groups resisting genocide"

[-] Pamasich@kbin.earth -3 points 1 day ago

Look, you're free to keep replying, but I'm not going to further talk here. I'm just writing this last comment to clarify that, so you can stop wasting your time. I realize that you're not arguing in good faith, so this is just going to go on endlessly otherwise.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 day ago

"Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past."

Jean-Paul Sartre

[-] agentant@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 days ago

Hamas does not fulfill my standards

Wow, we have a contender for most The Most Western Sentence of all time

[-] LeninWeave@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 day ago

They really managed to do worse than their earlier "This doesn’t mean I oppose resistance to genocide, this means I have expectations towards resistance groups."

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 5 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

But yes, I do support Palestinian resistance in theory

So my point was correct, Hamas is not morally pure enough for your standards, and you don't support resistance against genocide in practice, which is what matters because that's the actually existing resistance against genocide.

Hamas is supposed to be an enlightened leftist organization despite their members being executed, starved and deprived of the most basic resources by the people who threw them out of the lands they used to inhabit. Maybe, just maybe, there are material reasons caused by Israel that make Hamas not conform to your (or my) theoretical ideals?

[-] Pamasich@kbin.earth -2 points 2 days ago

and you don't support resistance against genocide in practice

What I don't agree with is that wording.

I don't support this specific form of resistance against genocide in practice. What you wrote there most literally means I don't support resistance against genocide in practice in general, which is what I can't agree with. If we're just talking about Hamas specifically, or the shape that resistance has taken in this genocide specifically, then I agree with the statement. But the way it's written here and was written before, I can't agree with it, it's too broadly worded and easily misconstrued when taken out of context.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 day ago

the shape that resistance has taken in this genocide specifically, then I agree with the statement.

Ok, so it's not that you oppose resistance to all genocides, you just oppose resistance to the Palestinian genocide.

[-] LeninWeave@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 day ago

Oh my fucking god, they just admitted it. he-admit-it i-am-adolf-hitler

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 days ago

This is just linguistic gymnastics, though. Hamas, and the broader Palestinian resistance, is the resistance to genocide. There isn't another, and better groups like the PFLP all work with Hamas, because they are fighting genocide and extermination.