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Rent is theft (thelemmy.club)
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[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 day ago

Guys, y’all should read up on Henry George. It’s so logical that it is accepted by both sides in politics.

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 5 points 23 hours ago

Meh. I'm a commie, and it's just a half measure. It attacks the problem of landlordism, sure, but it doesn't fight concentration of wealth in other forms, such as financial capital, capitalist ownership of media and means of production, or even climate change.

Moreover, it doesn't provide any means for organizing and actually carrying out the policy, which is why it never happens. Ideology and politics aren't exclusively a theoretical field in which we can democratically test every policy without disturbance, and Georgism doesn't answer the simple question: why would the landlords in power allow the workers to tax them our of power?

[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 hours ago

I think people don’t really realize that land makes up more than 50% of wealth. Unlike wealth taxes, it doesn’t produce inefficiency. However, you’re right that monopoly power in business is also a problem to solve. We need the return of antitrust, public ownership of natural monopolies, standards where needed, unions, and public R&D funding with public patents. But there is nothing that can effectively stop landlords from taking all the gains made by increasing wages and causing a divergence between renters and owners that will only get worse as long as demand in cities increases. Unless you tax land. Much of the stock market is also attached to land appreciation in the assets of stock traded companies.

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 1 points 3 hours ago

Why not remove the concept of landlords altogether then? Collectivizing the lands would be an even more complete version of land tax

[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 1 points 3 hours ago

A land value tax is exactly that. If someone wants to buy the rights to a plot and build something or if someone wants to buy the rights to live in a house, that price will already include the land no matter if it’s technically publicly owned or privately owned. Henry George agreed with you, he said that land should be public property, and that the best way to do that is to tax it according to its value.

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 1 points 3 hours ago

But why leave the building initiative in the hands of the market+tax instead of just collectively making political decisions about what gets built where?

[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 hours ago

How do you collectively make political decisions about what gets built where?

It sounds like the planning system. The planning system is a big part of why house prices are so high. The suburbs are not allowed to have anything but single family zoning. Commercial areas are not allowed to be built in residential areas. Why? Because people keep making rules to protect their land values. NIMBYism is a huge constraint to the supply of housing whether present at local hearings for a specific building or when making land use plans. One problem is that landowners (which most homeowners are), are severely overrepresented in a system where plans are decided collectively. Even if all the renters in the city also showed up, these collective plans will never include potential people wanting to move to the city cause they will not be part of this. This creates a bias towards plans that don’t allow for new housing because the residents are more likely to already have their living situation covered. This hurts: people seeking to move, renters, anyone wanting to move to the city, newer generations who don’t own property.

There are a number of other problems with this:

It’s impossible to plan for the future. People’s needs, wants and desires change constantly and you can’t plan for that. Even collectively. Cause what is planned collectively now, will not be the same decision if the plan was made a year later cause wants and desires have changed.

It also inhibits the optimal functioning of development. A plan may have height restrictions to prevent views from being interrupted or from shadows being cast, but this plan assumes that the value of these views and sunlight will in perpetuity be worth more than the supply of housing being prevented. Let’s say a plan includes the appearance of buildings in building codes. This missed all the individual creativity present in local communities. The people who know best what their community needs are the individuals living there. A lot of creativity is lost when one plan takes over the plans of many individuals. The historic centers that we love so much everywhere that we make them indestructible legally are all designed by individuals with unique ideas in ways that couldn’t be planned.

It also goes against the rule of law. Laws should be predictable, simple, and general. Planning laws are neither of those. Their lacking predictability increases the risk of every building project. Their lacking simplicity increases the legal costs for any developer making it hard for smaller players to compete with the big ones. Their lack of generality makes it possible for officials to give preferential treatment to certain owners. Do you know how much a plot of land increases in value if a planner decides that it’s suddenly allowed to have more stories built there? Let’s say these plans are created with a 51% majority vote. What about the 49%? None of this would have been necessary if people had more freedom.

This is not advocating for neoliberal society. You can make the rules more general. You can say buildings are not allowed to be 50% taller than its neighbors. Simple, general, predictable. You can say industrial areas are not allowed less than 400 meters from residential areas. Etc. You can have local land trusts.

Cities are so complex, that it cannot be planned top down. And bottom up approaches that attempt to democratize top down planning, is still top down. It’s authoritative and prone to corruption. Jane Jacobs argued that what makes the city are the millions of interactions and actions of its citizens, not a planning board.

Of course you need coordination. You can plan infrastructure, and the rules that filter out what are undesirable outcomes, but don’t plan the life.

[-] Quadhammer@lemmy.world 0 points 23 hours ago

See there's an issue you want a one size fits all that's never going to happen. Focus on fixing one thing that will help the population astronomically.

why would the landlords in power allow the workers to tax them our of power

Well through public ridicule or at gunpoint I'd imagine

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 3 points 23 hours ago

See there’s an issue you want a one size fits all that’s never going to happen

It's happened historically in several countries, whereas georgism has happened in a total of 0.

Well through public ridicule or at gunpoint I’d imagine

Great. Now, who are the people organizing and agitating the workers to gather the numbers and strength to do this at gunpoint? Hint: again, not the Georgists

[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 hours ago

Most countries used to tax land. The taxing of wages and capital is a fairly new concept. And many countries have currently adopted land value taxes in a smaller scale. Pennsylvania has experience with it. Denmark adopted it because of Henry George. Many countries have public land leasing like China and Singapore and the Netherlands.

[-] Digit@lemmy.wtf 5 points 1 day ago
[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 0 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

I get the problematic dualism in that statement. But what I mean is that his idea of a land value tax is both efficiency improving and equality improving.

[-] CAVOK@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Laughs in 8 different political parties deciding the direction of my country.

[-] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world -3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 23 hours ago)

It's so logical that nobody can understand it or support it..

Georgism has never ever been politically viable.

I worked in land theory, in a Georgist think-tank for 5 years.

What did I learn? That the citizens, the administrators, and the politicans, all hate Georgism because it is too fair and too progressive. Most lemmy users would hate it too, because it isn't about 'punishing' someone or 'rewarding' someone. It's good and neutral policy.

Logical and fair politics and policy is something everyone says 'is good' but they never want to actually do it because politics is about 'my side beating your side and hurting them'. Lemmy here is full of lefties who fantasize about beating up right wingers, and then claim they wish no harm on anyone except anyone who wishes harm on them.

[-] atcorebcor@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 hours ago

I don’t know, I’m in Europe, and my country introduced it because of Henry George. And it’s gaining traction in economics and urban planning.

[-] Riverside@reddthat.com 5 points 23 hours ago

Georgism: "let's introduce immense taxes to landlords"

You: "this is neutral and apolitical! I hate the left!"

this post was submitted on 03 Feb 2026
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