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German politician has her segment cut short for saying that Ukraine had a better peace plan on the table in 2022 (tankie.tube)
submitted 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) by to c/news@hexbear.net
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https://www.foreignaffairs.com/ukraine/talks-could-have-ended-war-ukraine | Archived

At the first meeting, the Russians presented a set of harsh conditions, effectively demanding Ukraine’s capitulation. This was a nonstarter. But as Moscow’s position on the battlefield continued to deteriorate, its positions at the negotiating table became less demanding. So on March 3 and March 7, the parties held a second and third round of talks [...]

https://sputnikglobe.com/20240428/ukraine-rejected-2022-peace-deal-over-russian-language-status--banning-nazism-terms---welt-1118153431.html

Regarding territorial issues, parts of the Donetsk and Lugansk regions of Donbass would remain under Russian control

Moscow ostensibly wanted Kiev to slash the size of its army to 85,000 people, while Ukraine insisted on retaining a strength of 250,000.

Edit: Replaced "reporter" with "politician" in the post title

Edit2: Changed title from "microphone cut" to "segment cut short" in the title

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[–] 7 points 11 months ago (6 children)

National socialism is a dog whistle for fascist.... Pretty much anyone claiming to want socialism for their nation independent from globalized socialism ends up being a Nazi.

I don't think you've really listened to me.

Traditional beliefs being hate mongering immigrants?

No but playing into working people's concerns about migrant workers driving down salaries and taking jobs? Yes. Exactly the same shit happens among parts of the left in the UK. Galloway has done exactly that. Nazi? No. Bit of a dickhead? Yes.

Guess what.....? The Nazi didn't run for office promising an. organizational structure of government.

I'm sorry but this is just wrong. The fascist organisation structure is quite specific and fascists absolutely did talk about it loudly during their rise. What the fuck do you think the fasces even represents? Fascists aren't hiding their goal of restructuring the very structure of government.

Can you give me an example of a fascist nation that didn't hold right winged social views?

Can you give me an example of a socialist nation that has not held these traditional social views? The only one that does not is Cuba, and that is only a recent development.

Ahh yes, both of those people famously hated immigrants.

There are no socialist countries with open borders that simply welcome everyone with open arms. In fact, socialist countries all have pretty strict borders, significantly more strict than the liberal countries of the EU.

You are mis-analysing these socialists and it is a mistake to call them nazis. They have backwards views because they're old fucks and out of touch, but they are absolutely left wing. If you dug up Mao or Deng they would probably explicitly agree with them, because they'd be old fucks today too, that wouldn't make them less communist though and it certainly wouldn't make them nazis. It would just make them old and out of touch with developing social issues.

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  • [–] -1 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    don't think you've really listened to me.

    Ditto....

    No but playing into working people's concerns about migrant workers driving down salaries and taking jobs? Yes.

    And this is different from the Nazi with Jews how exactly?

    . The fascist organisation structure is quite specific and fascists absolutely did talk about it loudly during their rise. What the fuck do you think the fasces even represents?

    I mean that's just ahistorical..... The center and right party did not cooperate with the Nazi party thinking they were going to be putting themselves out of power. The riechstag fire wouldn't have been necessary if this was the case.

    Can you give me an example of a socialist nation that has not held these traditional social views? The only one that does not is Cuba, and that is only a recent development.

    I think the Soviet union and especially West Germany were culturally progressive for the time.

    So how about that fascist socially progressive fascist nation?

    There are no socialist countries with open borders that simply welcome everyone with open arms. In fact, socialist countries all have pretty strict borders, significantly more strict than the liberal countries of the EU.

    You are conflating open borders with legal immigration.

    If you dug up Mao or Deng they would probably explicitly agree with them, because they'd be old fucks today too, that wouldn't make them less communist though

    Lol, sure.... The men who committed to war for their Korean neighbors, totally would be nationalistic isolationist who hates immigrants.

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  • [–] 9 points 11 months ago* (4 children)

    Ditto....

    No I have. As has everyone else on hexbear that totally disagrees with you.

    And this is different from the Nazi with Jews how exactly?

    Migrating to a country is a choice mate. If you don't understand how migration is a choice and being a fucking jew is not a choice we've got a fundamental problem with your ability to understand what immutable characteristics are.

    Migrants are not an ethnicity or religion. Racism does get tangled up in anti-migrant bullshit, absolutely. But the two are quite different things. Economic anxieties over migration are not the same thing as believing in the fucking master race, what is so hard for you to fucking understand about this?

    To understand one from another you need to look more closely at primary motivations for a person's position. Sometimes the 10% racist bullshit someone spews about migrants can mislead you into saying "this person is a fascist" when 90% of their motivation is not racism at all and the racist crap is just an offshoot of the other crap that has nothing to do with nazism.

    I mean that's just ahistorical.

    No it isn't.

    So how about that fascist socially progressive fascist nation?

    Why the fuck are you demanding I give you the name of something I never claimed to exist. Stop hitting me with your strawman dipshittery.

    I think the Soviet union and especially West Germany were culturally progressive for the time.

    Both had closed borders though, why are you not calling them fascists for their policy towards migrant work? Also you mean EAST Germany, and furthermore East Germany's socially progressive elements were driven by the goal of undermining western intelligence agencies that were for example blackmailing gay people into counter-revolution and spying. You can't blackmail people if you simply change the social view of gay people and thus the country undertook a huge campaign to remove the stigma and make it acceptable. Not out of the goodness of their hearts but driven by material conditions.

    You are conflating open borders with legal immigration.

    What the fuck do you think legal immigration is if not a person passing through a border that is open? Illegal immigration = passing into a country that has closed its borders to you. Legal migration = passing into a country that has opened its borders to you.

    Lol, sure.... The men who committed to war for their Korean neighbors, totally would be nationalistic isolationist who hates immigrants.

    China did not have an open border policy for migrant workers with the DPRK before or after the war. China's policy both then and now is forcible repatriation back to their home country. Your understanding of socialists both historic and current is idealistic and utopian. They don't have these policies, and did not back then, because they would be very bad policies that would be harmful to their own workers.

    I actually hate you for forcing me to defend this position. Because I don't agree with these people at all and I've come to blows with Galloway here in the UK more than once. But your labelling of these people as nazis is just completely absurd and unless you wrap your head around their position properly you will never understand the european left correctly, because you've incorrectly decided more than half of the european left are nazis.

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  • [–] -1 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    has everyone else on hexbear that totally disagrees with you.

    Lol, people aren't even engaging in my actual statement, they're just jousting with their own strawman arguments.

    Migrating to a country is a choice mate. If you don't understand how migration is a choice and being a fucking jew

    First of all a lot of the time the choice isn't that much of a choice. Secondly the important connection is that Jews were viewed as an outside group that could take the blame for problems created by an outdated economic system, the same as migrants.

    Migrants are not an ethnicity or religion. Racism does get tangled up in anti-migrant bullshit, absolutely.

    Lol, kinda conflicting statements there.

    Economic anxieties over migration are not the same thing as believing in the fucking master race, what is so hard for you to fucking understand about this?

    The vast majority of the population didn't support the Nazi because of some master race ideology. It was a reaction to the economic displacement caused by WW1 that was being blamed on minority groups in the country.

    Btw ... You seem to be making a lot of excuses for racist nationalist sentiments.

    Sometimes the 10% racist bullshit someone spews about migrants can mislead you into saying "this person is a fascist" when 90% of their motivation is not racism at all and the racist crap is just an offshoot of the other crap that has nothing to do with nazism.

    I suggest you actually maybe read some history about the rise of fascism in the wiemar Republic? Because economic displacement being blamed on minority groups is absolutely how fascist came to power.

    Why the fuck are you demanding I give you the name of something I never claimed to exist.

    "You've got it into your head that fascists all hold right wing social views and everyone else is not a fascist."

    Also you were the one who asked me to name culturally progressive socialist nations.....

    Both had closed borders though, why are you not calling them fascists for their policy towards migrant work?

    First of all closed border is a strawman argument that you injected, I was talking about legal immigration. Which both the Soviet union and East German had. Students and skilled workers were able to migrate to the Soviet union, and over 500k people migrated to East Germany before the Berlin wall was built.

    What the fuck do you think legal immigration is if not a person passing through a border that is open? Illegal immigration = passing into a country that has closed its borders to you. Legal migration = passing into a country that has opened its borders to you.

    A closed border by definition is a border like the Berlin wall or the demilitarized zone between north and South Korea. It's not just a normal border that requires a minimal amount of authorization to enter.

    China did not have an open border policy for migrant workers with the DPRK before or after the war. China's policy both then and now is forcible repatriation back to their home country.

    There are over 2 million ethnic Koreans living in China....

    actually hate you for forcing me to defend this position. Because I don't agree with these people at all and I've come to blows with Galloway here in the UK more than once.

    Lol, seems like you're more than happy to defend their positions and be dishonest while doing so.

    understand the european left correctly, because you've incorrectly decided more than half of the european left are nazis.

    Lol, racist asshole from the UK hates being called a Nazi. Very surprising. Yes, anyone who only cares about the workers of their own nation or ethnic background without regard to the rest of the workers of the world might as well be a little hitlerite. Not surprised a northerner is working overtime to defend racist.

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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    If you think someone is going to read your walls of drivel past the point you insult them you're not too bright.

    https://hexbear.net/ppb

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Lol, like you've been civil.... Also, my insult was literally at the very end of my response.

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago*

    I didn't insult you once, I said a few fucks here or there, saying some swearsies that aren't insults is just tone not incivility, claiming it's incivility is literal classism, the liberal demand that everyone talk like a suburban middle class PMC or else they're not speaking right is just a means of excluding working class voices from participation in spaces.

    And near the start of your post you absolutely slyly implied that I am a fucking nazi you fucking dipshit. Now I've insulted you.

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